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Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic

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Property proposal: Generic Authority control Person Organization
Event Creative work Term Space
Place Sports Sister projects
Economics Transportation Natural science Property metadata

See also[edit]


This page is for the proposal of new properties.

Before proposing a property
  1. Check if the property already exists by looking at Wikidata:List of properties (manual list) and Special:ListProperties.
  2. Check if the property was previously proposed or is on the pending list.
  3. Check if you can give a similar label and definition as an existing Wikipedia infobox parameter, or if it can be matched to an infobox, to or from which data can be transferred automatically.
  4. Select the right datatype for the property.
  5. Start writing the documentation based on the preload form below and add it in the appropriate section.

Creating the property

  1. Once consensus is reached, change status=ready on the template, to attract the attention of a property creator.
  2. Creation can be done 1 week after the proposal, by a property creator or an administrator.
  3. See steps when creating properties.


On this page, old discussions are archived. An overview of all archives can be found at this page's archive index. The current archive is located at 2017/12.

Generic properties[edit]

CPUID code[edit]

   Under discussion
Description CPUID identification code
Data type String
Template parameter "cpuid" in en:template:Infobox CPU
Allowed values hexadecimal string
Example Core i7-6700 (Q28739510) → 506E3 (see http://www.cpu-world.com/cgi-bin/CPUID.pl?CPUID=57560)
Motivation

CPUID code to identify a specific CPU microarchitecture. List of these codes can be found here : http://www.cpu-world.com/cgi-bin/CPUID.pl. Maybe other codes can be created too for family, model and stepping (in decimal) Mikayé (talk) 14:46, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment - no formatter URL to link directly to these values? ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:46, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support. I took the liberty of adding the formatter URL. --Swpb (talk) 16:37, 15 February 2017 (UTC)
    • @Swpb, Mikayé: That formatter URL does NOT work with the supplied example of 506E3 - it gives an invalid CPU ID error. ArthurPSmith (talk) 20:02, 16 February 2017 (UTC)
    • The formatter is not good. The value should be the value returned by the cpuid instruction, not the id on cpu-world website. I gave the website as an example of source to obtain the value for a specific CPU. I think Swpb made a confusion between the two cpuid. Maybe the cpu-world id can be another property but that's another story... I removed the formatter. Mikayé (talk) 10:27, 17 February 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support. This looks very useful to me. YULdigitalpreservation (talk) 14:50, 16 February 2017 (UTC)
  • I would like the description to contain more information about what the item is about, so that people who don't already know the abbrivation have an ID of what it's about by reading it. @Mikayé: ChristianKl (talk) 10:45, 20 February 2017 (UTC)
  • BA candidate.svg Weak oppose Intel documentation for how this code should be formatted for Intel processors is provided in figure 3-6 on page 3-204 of Intel® 64 and IA-32 Architectures Developer's Manual: Vol. 2A. AMD documentation is provided at the top of page 11 of AMD CPUID Specification. This proposal concerns me a little bit because it is actually an accumulation of multiple identifiers. I assume this accumulation is meant to be a mixture of Base Family (4 bits), Base Model (4 bits), Extended Family (8 bits), Extended Model (8 bits), but this proposal does not make it clear how these identifiers are to be arranged together. I propose an alternative approach which is to create 4 distinct properties for CPUID Base Family, CPUID Base Model, CPUID Extended Family and CPUID Extended Model. You may also want to investigate whether a CPUID Stepping (4 bits) property could be useful as well to capture revisions/manufacturing variants of each CPU. Dhx1 (talk) 14:06, 22 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment We need to be clear that the "CPUID code" being talked about here is part of the x86 / x86-64 CPU architecture, and so doesn't exist on CPUs of other architectures such as ARM, SPARC, POWER, MIPS, etc. (Those other CPU architectures may in some cases have similar facilities, but they probably won't be called "CPUID" and will likely have a different format.) So, I think the property proposal should be amended to clarify that this property is only for x86/x86-64 CPUs. Maybe change the label to "x86 CPUID code" or something like that to make it clear. SJK (talk) 22:20, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Tobias1984
Emw
Zuphilip
Danrok
콩가루
TomT0m
DrSauron
Ruud Koot
Andreasburmeister
Toto256
MichaelSchoenitzer
Metamorforme42
Pixeldomain
User:YULdigitalpreservation
Dipsode87
Azertus
Pintoch
Jsamwrites
Fractaler
Giovanni Alfredo Garciliano Diaz
Jura
FabC
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Informatics ChristianKl (talk) 13:09, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

  • Symbol support vote.svg Support ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 16:10, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose Having thought more about this I don't support it in its current form. What is being proposed here is something specific to the x86/x64 CPU architecture (predominantly Intel and AMD). There are many other CPU architecture families (ARM, SPARC, POWER, MIPS, etc), many of which have similar but distinct concepts. The proposal has no explanation of how it could work for those other CPU architecture families. I would be happy to support a proposal which demonstrated that those other CPU architectures had been thoughtfully considered, but see no evidence of that here. SJK (talk) 22:33, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment can you please explain how this relates to CPUID (Q1024235)? -- JakobVoss (talk) 20:14, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

dialect of[edit]

   Under discussion
Description inverse property of 'has dialect' (Property:P134)
Data type Item
Domain Languages
Example Q32008315 is a dialect of Q33044
Planned use For any item which a dialect of a language
See also Property:P134
Motivation

'Part of' Property:P361 is not specific enough, the property 'has dialect' Property:P134 has already been created to make this more clear but only links from the language to the dialect, not the other way around. John Cummings (talk) 14:56, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
Symbol support vote.svg Support in general we've been discouraging new inverse properties as the reverse direction is easily retrieved via the query service and the redundancy isn't helpful. However, in this case it seems to me this is the more useful direction, and perhaps we should consider even deleting has dialect (P134) if this gets created. ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:28, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support per ArthurPSmith Hsarrazin (talk) 17:55, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support - PKM (talk) 19:09, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support - very sensical. A good idea. -- BrillLyle (talk) 01:47, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support - would be good. Charles Matthews (talk) 05:52, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose I don't think this is a good idea. The distinction between "language" and "dialect" is a very very grey area with many things being described both ways depending on which source you look at, so I don't think it makes sense to add more properties specific to whether something is a dialect, language, language family, etc. I also don't think this is necessary. We already use instance of (P31) to store the fact that someone considers something a dialect and we currently use subclass of (P279) (which is way more common than part of (P361) on items marked as dialects) to create a tree. I don't think we should remove P279 statements (since that would break the tree) and we definitely shouldn't remove P31 statements, therefore this property would duplicate existing statements. I wouldn't be particularly opposed to replacing P279 with a new property (in the same way we have parent taxon (P171) for taxonomy) if people really wanted to, but that would need to be a property broader than "dialect of". - Nikki (talk) 07:07, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Nikki (talkcontribslogs), thanks very much for your reply, you are correct about the fuzziness of what is a language and what is a dialect. I feel like it may be possible to have something like 'parent taxon' and 'child taxon' but for languages, do you have suggestions of what these could be called? --John Cummings (talk) 12:39, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
The "fuzziness" should be addressed by sources: If source A says Foobar is a language, but source B says it is a dialect, add both statements, duly cited (and ranked if applicable). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:46, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Finding names which aren't too specific or too weird is hard. :( The best I can think of right now is "linguistic subdivision of" and "has linguistic subdivisions". - Nikki (talk) 13:03, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose as an inverse for an exiting property (neutral on replacing that existing property). Also, could those supporting this as the inverse of another property (@John Cummings, PKM, BrillLyle, Charles Matthews:) please explain why we need both? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:44, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
@Pigsonthewing: It is actually not generally accepted that inverse properties are undesirable. I believe that theoretical reasons for opposition, and practical reasons of convenience for creation, should be seen as a trade-off. In other words, I prefer to think of the situation now as case-by-case. A case in point is contributed to published work (P3919), where I had felt for a long time that the property was needed. The argument you present had a chilling effect on my bringing it up. Therefore, going forward, I don't think there should be such an onus placed on proposers, beyond the usual ones of utility. Charles Matthews (talk) 13:57, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
@Charles Matthews: My reasons for opposition are far from being merely "theoretical", so please do not try to dismiss them as such. Your accusation that I chilled a discussion in which I did not participate is, frankly, bizarre. It is indeed "not generally accepted that inverse properties are undesirable", but then nor is it "generally accepted that inverse properties are desirable"; hence my request for an explanation of why we need both in this case. You haven't answered the question. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:06, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Andy, slow down. There is indeed a "theoretical" argument against inverse properties. It is endemic here. I got it, for example, from Magnus, in personal conversation, in the case of contributed to published work (P3919). I neither was dismissing it, nor saying that in that case you had raised it with me, since we two never discussed that matter.
So, in this case, I think "is a dialect of" would be a fine property. I think it should be created. As you point out above, it involves statements that can and should be referenced. What I would argue is that simply blocking its creation on the grounds of the current existence of an inverse property is a procedural view that does Wikidata no favours.
Where a property and inverse both exist, it can be argued, if required, that one should be deleted. How else would one go about replacing a property by its inverse where just one is needed? Charles Matthews (talk) 05:10, 10 July 2017 (UTC)
And again you open with a trite effort to dismiss what I say, by telling me to "slow down". And still you offer no actual reason why the property is needed (since references can also be attached to the existing inverse; or the item itself). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:19, 10 July 2017 (UTC)
You know, being adversarial in this style leads you (often enough) into false positions. My language was impersonal: you took it personally. For heaven's sake. I was making a procedural point, also. We may have a cart-before-the-horse situation, where the existing property is less popular than its inverse might be. For those who dislike having both, there remains the issue of which would be more desirable. Do we have all dialects of English listed on the page English (Q1860)? Isn't it more maintainable for each dialect as added to be marked as "dialect of"? I don't see the difficulty with having both, but the analogy with contributed to published work (P3919) is fairly close. Charles Matthews (talk) 04:10, 11 July 2017 (UTC)
@Pigsonthewing, Charles Matthews: I also like inverse properties conceptually. I want more of them. But aside from that, I don't think <subclass of> is the right way to model a dialect or small language community. In the case of an endangered dialect spoken by ~120 people, how is this a "class"? What would be the hypothetical members of this class, each speaker's idiolect? As far as names for new relationship properties, "parent language or language group" and "child language or language group" might work. I agree that we should mark a language as a dialect if a source says it's a dialect, citing the source, and not otherwise.- PKM (talk) 19:51, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Thanks very much for your comments. @Pigsonthewing:. I think you are correct this isn't the right term. Having looked at Glottolog it appears the correct language to use is 'child language' and 'parent language' to describe this. If 'dialect of' is not correct then 'has dialect' is also incorrect. Do we simply rename the 'has dialect' property to child language? My reasoning for having properties on both the parent and child properties are fairly universal. In my experience not having a property on the item is causing many people to fill in the gaps incorrectly based on a lack of understanding of the subject. World Heritage sites are a good example where people are adding World Heritage status to all the items which are part of a World Heritage site rather than 'part of'. This leads to a lot of visualisations looking very odd indeed. Having only child taxon statements only makes sense when running queries and looking at the items individually if you know that this is the system, otherwise it just looks like data is missing. It also means that people can only travel from the language to the dialect and not the other way around. Thanks --John Cummings (talk) 16:10, 10 July 2017 (UTC)
The naming issue was not my concern. I suggest that we can deal with the "gap filling" by using a complex, "conflicts with", constraint. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:19, 10 July 2017 (UTC)
@Pigsonthewing:, can you link to something that would help me understand what you mean? Thanks --John Cummings (talk) 21:06, 10 July 2017 (UTC)
Lots of examples, using {{Complex constraint}}, via [1]. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:13, 11 July 2017 (UTC)
@Pigsonthewing:, I think I'm being thick... as far as I understood the complex constraint function (not sure what to call it) flags when someone puts to conflicting statements on the same item or if someone puts a clearly wrong value to a property. I don't understand how this links languages together or why this would be a better solution than inverse properties. My understanding is using inverse properties is a simple way to help people move between items and run queries. --John Cummings (talk) 22:08, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Qualifiers for locations within pdfs, djvu etc[edit]

title or cover page number[edit]

   Ready Create
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the title page is located
Data type Quantity
Template parameter "Cover image", in Wikisource indexes
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example File:Relatório ao governador do estado de Alagoas (1929-1930).pdf4

preface page number[edit]

(added 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of a preface is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

table of contents page number[edit]

(added 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the table of contents is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

alphabetical index page number[edit]

(added 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the alphabetical index is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

persons index page number[edit]

(added 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the index of names of people is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

place name index page number[edit]

(added 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the index of names of geographic place names is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

table of illustrations page number[edit]

(added 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the table of illustrations is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

end notes page number[edit]

(added 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of end notes is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

glossary page number[edit]

(added 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the glossary is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

bibliography page number[edit]

(added 6 December 2017 (UTC))

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of the glossary is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example

appendix page number[edit]

   Under discussion
Description qualifier to indicate the number of the page of a document in which the first page of a appendix is located
Data type Quantity
Domain Commons documents (pdf, djvu etc), URLs to pdfs/djvu
Allowed values numbers
Example
Motivation

This is useful for Wikisource and the upcoming integration of Wikibase into Commons. ~nmaia d 18:17, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

  • Given some of the comments below, rephrased the initial proposal for a "cover page" property as a qualifier for pdf/djvu files and completed it with a few other qualifiers that can (if applicable), but don't have to be used. Datatype "number" should be quantity. These could be used independently of Commons.
    --- Jura 16:24, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
Discussion

Aubrey
Viswaprabha (talk)
Micru
Tpt
EugeneZelenko
User:Jarekt
Maximilianklein (talk)
Don-kun
VIGNERON (talk)
Jane023 (talk) 08:21, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Alexander Doria (talk)
Ruud 23:15, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
Kolja21
arashtitan
Jayanta Nath
Yann (talk)
John Vandenberg (talk) 09:14, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
JakobVoss
Danmichaelo (talk) 19:30, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
Ravi (talk)
Mvolz (talk) 08:21, 20 July 2014 (UTC)
Hsarrazin (talk) 07:56, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Accurimbono
Mushroom
PKM (talk) 19:58, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
Revi 16:54, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
Giftzwerg 88 (talk) 23:36, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Almondega (talk) 00:17, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
maxlath
Jura to help sort out issues with other projects
Epìdosis
Skim (talk) 13:52, 24 June 2016 (UTC)
Marchitelli (talk) 12:29, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
BrillLyle (talk) 15:33, 26 August 2016 (UTC)
Alexmar983 (talk) 23:53, 28 August 2016 (UTC)
Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) (talk) 10:44, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Chiara (talk) 14:15, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Thibaut120094 (talk) 20:31, 14 September 2016 (UTC)
Ivanhercaz | Discusión Plume pen w.png 15:30, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
YULdigitalpreservation (talk) 17:35, 10 November 2016 (UTC)
User:Jc3s5h PatHadley (talk) 21:51, 15 December 2016 (UTC)
Erica (ohmyerica) (talk) 19:26, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
User:Timmy_Finnegan
Mauricio V. Genta (talk) 05:38, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
Sam Wilson 09:24, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
Sic19 (talk) 22:25, 12 July 2017 (UTC)
Andreasmperu
MartinPoulter (talk) 09:21, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
ThelmadatterThelmadatter (talk) 01:11, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
Zeroth (talk) 15:01, 16 September 2017 (UTC)
Emeritus
Ankry
Beat Estermann (talk) 20:07, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Shilonite - specialize in cataloging Jewish & Hebrew books
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Books.

  • Symbol support vote.svg Support --Jarekt (talk) 19:37, 27 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support --Mauricio V. Genta (talk) 20:37, 27 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question Is this a qualifier for either Wikisource index page (P1957) or scanned file on Wikimedia Commons (P996)? It seems that as a property on its own it has to refer to some particular edition or scan of a book. Sam Wilson 00:44, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
    • Neither, this would be used directly as a statement for a document file on Commons. Or for specific editions with Wikidata entries, like you mentioned. ~nmaia d 02:04, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
      • But individual files on Commons don't get individual WD items. For example, The Nether World (Q23308118) has three scanned files and therefore 3 cover pages. How would this property be used for that sort of item? (Sorry if I'm misunderstanding things.) Sam Wilson 07:53, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
        • Correct, but Commons is getting a Wikidata backend very soon, which means files will be able to be described using our properties; it's not common but possible that this property can be used on Wikidata too, in a specific edition of a work, when the accompanying pdf is present. Regarding your second question, The Nether World (Q23308118) has three covers because it has three volumes: we can add this property to each volume on Commons, to make it more accurate. In my opinion, using image (P18) with page(s) (P304) is not a very satisfying solution, as it doesn't necessarily make it clear to reusers that it's the cover image being shown. ~nmaia d 11:14, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question Is this a statement for direct cover image from c:Category:Book covers category? Skim (talk) 07:03, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
    • No, I've reworded the label according to @Maxlath's suggestion to make it clearer (thanks!) ~nmaia d 11:14, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question Could the property label be more explicit? Something like "cover page number"? As such, I first thought this property was to link to the media file displaying the cover image. -- Maxlath (talk) 08:57, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
    • Done, cheers! ~nmaia d 11:14, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
I also thought that would be a commons file. We also do need "cover page number" for PDF/DjVu files, but that should be a qualifier of scanned file on Wikimedia Commons (P996) as even 2 different scans of the same book might be off by a page or two. This property does not make sense if not paired up with a specific file. --Jarekt (talk) 16:35, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
Pictogram voting question.svg Question Is it somewhere documented that the Wikibase backend for Commons will use the same properties as Wikidata? My current understanding was that it will have its own properties. --Pasleim (talk) 19:29, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
Ah, in that case it seems this property would be most useful in Commons. However some people here in the discussion see value in it as a qualifier, so I'll leave it up to them to argue for it. ~nmaia d 16:08, 15 October 2017 (UTC)
Pictogram voting question.svg Question An other possibility for the range would be to have something like "my book cover.jpg" or "my book.djvu/2". But the second syntax is not supported yet by the "commons media" datatype (but it should be possible to add support of it). Tpt (talk) 20:24, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support if this a a qualifier for the scanned file on Wikimedia Commons (P996) property. It would have not meaning in another context... --Hsarrazin (talk) 15:53, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
    • Symbol support vote.svg Support in this case too. Skim (talk) 05:41, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment why shouldn't this be stored directly at Commons?
    --- Jura 15:28, 16 August 2017 (UTC)
  • because Commons is not the main user, but wikisource(s) ? --Hsarrazin (talk) 16:11, 16 August 2017 (UTC)
    • I don't think Commons Wikibase wont be accessible from Wikisource.
      --- Jura 16:45, 16 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 20:01, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose I've marked this as not ready and I don't believe it will work in wikidata until I actually see a concrete example of an item where this property could be added, or a statement where it could be used as a qualifier. The example in the current proposal is invalid - the "File" linked is not a wikidata item with a Q ID. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:27, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
  • I agree with ArthurPSmith that it would be nice to have a proper example. ChristianKl (talk) 15:28, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

Aubrey
Viswaprabha (talk)
Micru
Tpt
EugeneZelenko
User:Jarekt
Maximilianklein (talk)
Don-kun
VIGNERON (talk)
Jane023 (talk) 08:21, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Alexander Doria (talk)
Ruud 23:15, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
Kolja21
arashtitan
Jayanta Nath
Yann (talk)
John Vandenberg (talk) 09:14, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
JakobVoss
Danmichaelo (talk) 19:30, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
Ravi (talk)
Mvolz (talk) 08:21, 20 July 2014 (UTC)
Hsarrazin (talk) 07:56, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Accurimbono
Mushroom
PKM (talk) 19:58, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
Revi 16:54, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
Giftzwerg 88 (talk) 23:36, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Almondega (talk) 00:17, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
maxlath
Jura to help sort out issues with other projects
Epìdosis
Skim (talk) 13:52, 24 June 2016 (UTC)
Marchitelli (talk) 12:29, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
BrillLyle (talk) 15:33, 26 August 2016 (UTC)
Alexmar983 (talk) 23:53, 28 August 2016 (UTC)
Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) (talk) 10:44, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Chiara (talk) 14:15, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Thibaut120094 (talk) 20:31, 14 September 2016 (UTC)
Ivanhercaz | Discusión Plume pen w.png 15:30, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
YULdigitalpreservation (talk) 17:35, 10 November 2016 (UTC)
User:Jc3s5h PatHadley (talk) 21:51, 15 December 2016 (UTC)
Erica (ohmyerica) (talk) 19:26, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
User:Timmy_Finnegan
Mauricio V. Genta (talk) 05:38, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
Sam Wilson 09:24, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
Sic19 (talk) 22:25, 12 July 2017 (UTC)
Andreasmperu
MartinPoulter (talk) 09:21, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
ThelmadatterThelmadatter (talk) 01:11, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
Zeroth (talk) 15:01, 16 September 2017 (UTC)
Emeritus
Ankry
Beat Estermann (talk) 20:07, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Shilonite - specialize in cataloging Jewish & Hebrew books
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Books @NMaia: Can you provide an example? ChristianKl (talk) 21:54, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

Throughout the discussions I was convinced this was more suitable as a Commons property, but since others saw potential in it, I let the discussion happen on its own. ~nmaia d 21:05, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose in its current form, but if this were to be a qualifier for scanned file on Wikimedia Commons (P996) and were renamed "title page number" as that seems to be what it's actually representing. A "cover page" I think is the actual cover of a book, whereas this is (I think) about the title page (Q1339862). Sam Wilson 01:59, 6 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support as title page number qualifier for scanned file on Wikimedia Commons (P996). It should be possible to get this information from statements here. Additional qualifiers for table of contents, place name index, etc. would be helpful.
    --- Jura 08:39, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
  • @Jura1: If you support it in that form, can you provide an example of how you would want it to be used and edit the description to express the new scope? ChristianKl () 14:30, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
    • sure, I added above accordingly, including some other qualifiers.
      --- Jura 15:42, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Ok, this is now a completely revised proposal for 8(?) new properties; I believe (A) it should start over from scratch to avoid the confusion of the above discussion about a quite different proposal, and (B) all of these seem much more appropriate for discussion as Commons properties rather than as Wikidata properties - on Commons there would be no need to limit these to being just qualifiers. So I'd recommend we table this proposal until the Commons structured data implementation is close, and then introduce these as proposed properties there specifically for Commons. I don't see that they add much useful to have them within Wikidata itself. ArthurPSmith (talk) 20:23, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I'm not really aware of what Commons is doing, intends to do or might eventually have done. It's not really relevant to these proposals. The problem is that Commons and other archives host pdfs and similar files and Wikidata links to them, but these are generally not structured. Some files are transcribed at Wikisource, but not all of them. As we can't do statements on statements, we need specific qualifiers. As the initial proposal was for a title page and the qualifier approach has support, I'm marking the first one as ready.
    --- Jura 20:29, 6 December 2017 (UTC)

place visited[edit]

   Under discussion
Description places a specific person visited, with qualifier start time (P580), end time (P582) or point in time (P585)
Data type Item
Domain people
Allowed values places
Example Emmanuel Macron (Q3052772)Berlin (Q64) (twice), Gao (Q188904), Brussels (Q239) (twice), Taormina (Q199952), Rabat (Q3551), Bamako (Q3703), Hamburg (Q1055), Lausanne (Q807), Trieste (Q546)
Robot and gadget jobs QuickStatements may help
See also destination point (P1444), via (P2825)
Motivation

See Wikidata:Project_chat#Che_Guevara.27s_travel_diary. This may be a better approach but also we should consider how to deal with so many values. GZWDer (talk) 06:14, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

Related: en:List of people by number of countries visited & en:List of pedestrian circumnavigators & en:Category:Diplomatic visits by heads of government. Emijrp (talk) 06:35, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

This might be useful for all travelling literature, e.g. for In Search of the Castaways (Q1213902) migt be Patagonia (Q1507)... JAn Dudík (talk) 07:12, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

  • Symbol support vote.svg Support In case of extended travel schedules or, e.g., a high number of state visits, entries may add up considerably. Is there a discussion of data structures somewhere which could support longer lists? Jneubert (talk) 07:28, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support, but I disagree with the suggested use on In Search of the Castaways (Q1213902) and the likes. Thierry Caro (talk) 07:53, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support I ran into this issue in connection with Literature, Geolocation and Wikidata (Q26236257). I wrote "Travelling may be an important part of the life of an author. If the author stays long enough at a place then residence could possibly come into use. However, I know of no present Wikidata property to record more temporary stays." I suppose that for travelling authors such as Johannes V. Jensen (Q159552) and Hans Christian Andersen (Q5673) it might sometimes be difficult to determine what is residence and what is visits. One may also be concerned about long listings (on the other hand we have scientific articles with over 1'000 authors). — Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) (talk) 09:10, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question which qualifier should indicate purpose of visit? d1g (talk) 09:15, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support and Pictogram voting question.svg Question This property is going to concern to all human items. Everybody travel to a few places in their lives. I guess most people just travel to a few dozens places (if we are going to state them to city resolution) or less if we are going to set them to country resolution. But in the other hand we could end with hundred of thousands of people who have visited hundreds of places (not only heads of states, but almost any politician, actor, sportpeople, etc). I am noting this just in case we prefer to warn about this discussion taking place to a broader audience. Emijrp (talk) 12:41, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose mainly, because I don't think the sample is a useful one. Besides, somehow I think we already have this.
    --- Jura 17:58, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
    • Actually, it's via (P2825) we got. Sample: Q1225170#P2825 --- Jura 07:05, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
      • Well, via (P2825) works for intermediate point within itinaries, but not for disconnected journeys to different destinations (e.g., head of states' visits). Jneubert (talk) 10:13, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
  • BA candidate.svg Weak oppose as items will get really cluttered really fast unless, for example, we can actively prevent users from adding statements with this property without a non-imported from (P143) reference or we can better define a 'visit' for the purposes of this property. Mahir256 (talk) 02:48, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question how many statements would this be for Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh (Q80976) ?
    --- Jura 10:33, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
    • Probably a lot. Assuming he (or any other world leader) has visited all countries once, or even twice, we would end with 2*200 statements (plus dates). But we have similar "issues" with other kind of items, like places with population statements, academic papers with many authors, etc. I don't think that we are going to have tomorrow thousands of items with hundreds of place_visited statements, I guess that it will grow gradually as (I hope) Wikidata interface will get improved. Emijrp (talk) 10:52, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
      • The problem with overloading people items is that afterwards they become unusable for some applications. It might not matter with academic papers or chess players, but if we start doing that with any kind of item, Wikidata stops being useful.
        --- Jura 10:58, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
        • That’s crying before being hurt. That Wikidata could be overloaded is certain, that it will be is a totally different story. The only way to know is to try - always possible to put limits if that goes out of control. But, here, I doubt this will actually generates tons of datas - there is very few people for which someone would bother doing this tedious job. author  TomT0m / talk page 12:30, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
          • We already know what happens with academic papers and chess players. You might want to go and discover yourself ..
            --- Jura 12:51, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Should we ping some Wikidata developers? So they give their opinions, User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE), User:Lydia Pintscher (WMDE). Emijrp (talk) 11:04, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Hello, I'll ask the question to the developers. Since most of us are preparing for Wikimania, then will be there, this could take a bit of time. Lea Lacroix (WMDE) (talk) 11:59, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose Can be solved with location (P276) View with SQID qualified with dates. Maybe a case for a property « domiciliation » if we don’t have one however. author  TomT0m / talk page 12:30, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

fully subdivised into[edit]

   Under discussion
Description that location or object is fully subdivised into the parts given in qualifier
Data type MISSING
Domain places, physical objects
Allowed values places, physical objects
Example
Motivation 
The administrative division process is a known and studied problem (see for example this document in french - https://publications.polymtl.ca/832/1/2012_PierreDelaPoixdeFreminville.pdf ). Also administrative territorial entities can be quite complicated and there could be several kind of divisions that fully covers a division - electoral divisions can be different from other administrative divisions of the same territory. There may also be non administrative relevant divisions of a territory. This proposal can solve this by regrouping those into several statements. Under the same rationale that lead to disjoint union search and disjoint union of (P2738) View with SQID this allows to state that the list of divisions is complete. If that information is spread into multiple « has part » statement it’s more difficult to state that we know nothing has been forgotten (Maybe with
subject > has parts of the class (P2670) View with SQID < canton >
quantity (P1114) View with SQID < 7 >
…) author  TomT0m / talk page 15:39, 3 August 2017 (UTC)


Discussion
  • Why isn't this under Generic property proposals? - Brya (talk) 06:33, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I think the first usecase should currently be handled with contains administrative territorial entity (P150).
    --- Jura 13:24, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment @TomT0m: 1. How exactly will you represent different groupings (electoral vs administrative)? Give a specific example. 2. "Fully" is a slippery thing. If a new subregion is created, or I delete one of the statements, does that make all the "fully" statements untrue? 3. Please be precise in your descriptions and examples! You use the P' template with non-existing props, Q' template with some strings where the result just doesn't parse reasonably, etc. Second time today I see a sloppy proposal from you, and this is just not like you, Tom! --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 09:34, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose per Vladimir Alexiev and Jura. − Pintoch (talk) 08:01, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Český Krumlov Encyclopedia ID[edit]

   Not done
Description Český Krumlov Encyclopedia ID is id for online encyclopedia of town Český Krumlov. This encyclopedia have articles about buildings, history and people linked with the town. The encyclopedia is in czech, deutsch and englisch language.
Represents Český Krumlov Encyclopedia identifier (Q36152680)
Data type External identifier
Example no label (Q31205833)mesto_objekt_nams7
Formatter URL http://www.encyklopedie.ckrumlov.cz/docs/en/„$1“.xml
Robot and gadget jobs Robots can add this property using title of page in encyclopedia.
Motivation

In this page is a lot of information that are not in any other websites. In the website is informations about people linked with the city (such as Egon Schiele, Petr Vok and others), buildings in the city and history of the city and region Český Krumlov in three languages (czech, englisch and deutsch). Walter Klosse (talk) 12:54, 12 August 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

print run[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Print run of a publication
Represents circulation (Q759811)
Data type Number (not available yet)
Domain books
Allowed values [0-9]
Example no label (Q36698764) → 3000
Planned use w:fr:Modèle:Infobox Titre de livre-jeu
Robot and gadget jobs no
Motivation

French :

Bonjour,

je n'ai pas trouvé de propriété permettant d'indiquer le tirage d'un ouvrage (principalement le tirage initial), je pense que cette propriété serait utile à l'avenir également pour les infobox concernant la littérature générale Template:Infobox book (Q5858283).

English :

Hello, I haven't fond any property allowing us to indicate the print run of a book or other publication (especially the iunitial print run), and I think this property might be useful also for infoboxes about general literature Template:Infobox book (Q5858283).

PhiJai (talk) 19:47, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
Symbol support vote.svg Support We already have quantity (P1114), but special property is better. Consider to name it "number of copies".--Jklamo (talk) 12:25, 5 September 2017 (UTC)

Aubrey
Viswaprabha (talk)
Micru
Tpt
EugeneZelenko
User:Jarekt
Maximilianklein (talk)
Don-kun
VIGNERON (talk)
Jane023 (talk) 08:21, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Alexander Doria (talk)
Ruud 23:15, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
Kolja21
arashtitan
Jayanta Nath
Yann (talk)
John Vandenberg (talk) 09:14, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
JakobVoss
Danmichaelo (talk) 19:30, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
Ravi (talk)
Mvolz (talk) 08:21, 20 July 2014 (UTC)
Hsarrazin (talk) 07:56, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Accurimbono
Mushroom
PKM (talk) 19:58, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
Revi 16:54, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
Giftzwerg 88 (talk) 23:36, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Almondega (talk) 00:17, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
maxlath
Jura to help sort out issues with other projects
Epìdosis
Skim (talk) 13:52, 24 June 2016 (UTC)
Marchitelli (talk) 12:29, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
BrillLyle (talk) 15:33, 26 August 2016 (UTC)
Alexmar983 (talk) 23:53, 28 August 2016 (UTC)
Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) (talk) 10:44, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Chiara (talk) 14:15, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
Thibaut120094 (talk) 20:31, 14 September 2016 (UTC)
Ivanhercaz | Discusión Plume pen w.png 15:30, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
YULdigitalpreservation (talk) 17:35, 10 November 2016 (UTC)
User:Jc3s5h PatHadley (talk) 21:51, 15 December 2016 (UTC)
Erica (ohmyerica) (talk) 19:26, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
User:Timmy_Finnegan
Mauricio V. Genta (talk) 05:38, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
Sam Wilson 09:24, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
Sic19 (talk) 22:25, 12 July 2017 (UTC)
Andreasmperu
MartinPoulter (talk) 09:21, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
ThelmadatterThelmadatter (talk) 01:11, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
Zeroth (talk) 15:01, 16 September 2017 (UTC)
Emeritus
Ankry
Beat Estermann (talk) 20:07, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Shilonite - specialize in cataloging Jewish & Hebrew books
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Books

@PhiJai: I would like the description to not simply use the same words as the label and explain the concept in a sentence. ChristianKl (talk) 12:29, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment how do we know if the quantity is the initial print run or the grand total? − Pintoch (talk) 08:06, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Credit Card Properties[edit]

I am proposing several properties that can be used to accurately represent and structure data about individual credit cards (or other payment cards). This information could be used so people can accurately find and use information about their credit cards from a single source, without dealing with marketing and hidden data. I've tried to align with http://schema.org/PaymentCard where possible. A full example is defined below:

Chase Sapphire Reserve (Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863))

I'm not sure about "applies to part", maybe another better qualifier could be used.

This could potentially have other properties, such as:

and include other perks such as:

ChristianMoore (talk) 18:42, 28 August 2017 (UTC)

It has been almost a month, can one of the Propertycreators create these? Thank you in advance

ChristianMoore (talk) 07:35, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Symbol support vote.svg Support @ChristianMoore: Seems you've thought a lot about these props, so I support them en-masse. Could you consider generalizing some of them to other financial products as well? The full Schema Financial documentation is here http://schema.org/docs/financial.html --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 09:45, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Card Network[edit]

   Done. card network (P4443) (Talk and documentation)
Description Credit or Debit Card Network
Represents Payment processor (Q17074350)
Data type Item
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Allowed values Examples: Visa Inc. (Q328840), MasterCard (Q489921), American Express (Q194360), "Discover Bank"
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → Card Network → Visa Inc. (Q328840)
Source Individual card websites
Planned use See description
See also operator (P137)

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps

Discussion
  • How is this different from operator (P137) ("person or organization that operates the equipment, facility, or service"), besides for the added level of specificity? (I'm not very knowledgeable about how credit card networks work.) --Yair rand (talk) 00:26, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
    • The card network could also be described as the Payment Processor, as they do not "operate" or "manage" the card but instead process the transactions (and other duties, see here). I do think we can use operator (P137) for "Issuer" though, and have updated the property proposal to indicate. ChristianMoore (talk) 21:15, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support per Vladimir Alexiev − Pintoch (talk) 08:14, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
  • @Pintoch, Yair rand, ChristianMoore, Vladimir_Alexiev: ✓ Done Created as card network (P4443). ChristianKl (talk) 10:47, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Issuer[edit]

   Not done
Description Credit or Debit Card Issuer
Represents Issuer (Q1337949)
Data type Item
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Allowed values Examples: Chase Bank (Q524629), Wells Fargo (Q744149)
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → Issuer → Chase Bank (Q524629)
Source Individual card websites
Planned use See description
See also issued by (P2378)

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps

Discussion

Reward Program[edit]

   Done. reward program (P4446) (Talk and documentation)
Description The reward program associated with a particular item
Represents Reward Program (Q38075442)
Data type Item
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Allowed values Reward programs
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → Reward Program → Chase Ultimate Rewards (Q38073885)
Source Individual card websites
Planned use See description

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps

Discussion

Minimum Spend Bonus[edit]

Description Reward for spending a sum of money
Data type Number (not available yet)
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Allowed units types of loyalty points (Chase Ultimate Reward Point (Q38074153), SkyMiles (Q16984670))
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → 50,000 (units: Chase Ultimate Reward Point (Q38074153))

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps

Discussion

Cash Back[edit]

   Done. cash back (P4448) (Talk and documentation)
Description Cash or Points received for spending money as part of a loyalty program
Data type Number (not available yet)
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Allowed units currency
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → 3 (units: percentage (Q11229)), qualifiers: applies to part (P518): travel (Q61509)
Source Individual card websites

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps. The items used for the applies to qualifier will have to be structured. There isn't a really good source of data for the different reward categories, however the Visa Supplier Locator could be used to help define these categories.

Discussion

Reward[edit]

   Done. reward (P4444) (Talk and documentation)
Description A reward, bonus, or prize received as part of a membership or loyalty program
Data type Item
Domain payment card (Q1436963)
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863) → reward → no label (Q38074522) (this was deleted, so another example: travel insurance (Q1270407))
Discussion

Grace Period[edit]

   Done. grace period (P4445) (Talk and documentation)
Description period immediately after the deadline for an obligation during which a fee is waived
Represents grace period (Q4148421)
Data type Number (not available yet)
Domain used as a qualifier on a fee
Allowed units time
Example Chase Sapphire Reserve (Q38074863)fee (P2555) → 450, qualifier: grace period: 1 year
Discussion

Merchant Category Code[edit]

Description four-digit number used to classify businesses by the type of goods or services it provides.
Represents Merchant Category Code (Q2348386)
Data type String
Allowed values \d{4}
Example Delta Air Lines (Q188920) → MCC → 3058
Source Visa Supplier Locator & Citi MCC Guide
Planned use See description

See Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic/CardProps. This will be used to add Merchant Category Codes to businesses. This will help users like credit card transactions to places of business and to accurately calculate their expected rewards from credit cards.

Discussion

UEFA ranking[edit]

   Under discussion
Description The annual UEFA ranking of each national team, country (association) and team.
Represents UEFA coefficient (Q491781) and UEFA coefficient (women) (Q2981732)
Data type Number (not available yet)
Domain National teams and non-national in association football and football associations
Example
< Royal Spanish Football Federation (Q207615) View with Reasonator View with SQID > UEFA ranking search < 1 >
point in time (P585) View with SQID < 2017 >
points for (P1358) View with SQID < 89.212 >

< Real Madrid FC (Q8682) View with Reasonator View with SQID > UEFA ranking search < 1 >
point in time (P585) View with SQID < 2017 >
points for (P1358) View with SQID < 134.000 >

< Germany national football team (Q43310) View with Reasonator View with SQID > UEFA ranking search < 1 >
point in time (P585) View with SQID < 2017 >
points for (P1358) View with SQID < 40,236 >
Source http://www.uefa.com/memberassociations/uefarankings/index.html (and other pages like https://kassiesa.home.xs4all.nl/bert/uefa/data/method5/crank2018.html)
Planned use Add the rankings and coefficients since 1960. (UEFA started publishing ranking since 1979 but for statistical purposes, various rankings were introduced to portray the history of competitions).
See also no label (P2656)
Motivation

I believe UEFA rankings and coefficients must be on every team on the list. The idea is to have the ranking of the team and the points (Coefficient) the teams have. For country and club there is a final ranking every year and for national teams every 2 years. A problem is the country ranking. These rankings are for the countries member of UEFA. The football associations. But, nowadays there are male and female ranking. The association items are the same for both cases. We need a way to show that in the items. Xaris333 (talk) 11:39, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

Delusion23
WFC
happy5214
Fawkesfr
Xaris333
A.Bernhard
Cekli829
Japan Football
HakanIST
Jmmuguerza
H4stings
Unnited meta
محمد آدم
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Association football, @Frisko:

@Xaris333: How about this:

 Royal Spanish Football Federation (Q207615)
   ranking (P1352) - 1
   score by (P447)- Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)
   point in time (P585) - 2017
   points for (P1358) - 89.212

The second question you ask could be modeled by adding to "points for" also "unit - UEFA coefficient". But I think that's redundant with "score by - UEFA", and unfortunately points for (P1358) says it's "quantity property without units" (I think this restriction should be relaxed). In any case, we can record this general statement:

 UEFA coefficient (Q491781)
   score by (or creator, or publisher) - Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)

--Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 08:13, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

@Vladimir Alexiev: I haven't understood the last one. How you use UEFA coefficient (Q491781)? Use the above example please. Xaris333 (talk) 13:40, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
@Vladimir Alexiev: adding to "points for" also "unit - UEFA coefficient" is not useful. We need another way. And what about the female ranking? Xaris333 (talk) 15:30, 15 October 2017 (UTC)


Delusion23
WFC
happy5214
Fawkesfr
Xaris333
A.Bernhard
Cekli829
Japan Football
HakanIST
Jmmuguerza
H4stings
Unnited meta
محمد آدم
Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Association football

Examples

Country coefficient (men football)

Royal Spanish Football Federation (Q207615)

   ranking (P1352) - 1
   score by (P447)- Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)
   point in time (P585) - 2017
   points for (P1358) - 89.212

Country coefficient (women football)

Royal Spanish Football Federation (Q207615)

   ranking (P1352) - 6
   score by (P447)- Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)
   point in time (P585) - 2017
   points for (P1358) - 41.000

Real Madrid FC (Q8682)

   ranking (P1352) - 1
   score by (P447)- Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)
   point in time (P585) - 2017
   points for (P1358) - 134.00

Germany national football team (Q43310)

   ranking (P1352) - 1
   score by (P447)- Union of European Football Associations (Q35572)
   point in time (P585) - 2017
   points for (P1358) - 40.236

2 problems:

1) A problem is the country ranking. These rankings are for the countries member of UEFA. The football associations. But, nowadays there are male and female ranking. The association items are the same for both cases. We need a way to show that in the items.

2) The second problem is that we need to link to someway to UEFA coefficient (Q491781) or UEFA coefficient (women) (Q2981732) for all cases. Xaris333 (talk) 15:47, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment This is independent from the question whether we should include this ranking system: For rankings in general, we might want to move to something like:
<some item: e.g. person> <property: ranking system> <item: whatever ranking system> <qualifier: rank>1
--- Jura 07:36, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

@Jura1: so you are agree with Vladimir Alexiev that we don't need no label (P2656) either? I made a delete proposal Wikidata:Properties for deletion#Property:P2656. Xaris333 (talk) 15:48, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

  • Not necessarily. For frequently used rankings, it can be more convenient to have a separate property. So I don't have much of an opinion on P2656.
    --- Jura 18:05, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Number of phases[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Separate phases/poles in an electrical transmission or connector
Data type Quantity
Domain Electricity
Allowed values 1, 3, [any]
Allowed units Unitless
Example 1 → single-phase, 3 → three-phase, 5 → 5 phases.
Source en:Single-phase electric power, en:Three-phase electric power
Planned use Type 2 connector (Q2335519), SAE J1772 (Q2204743), IEC 60309 (Q1653425), …
Robot and gadget jobs Hope not.
Motivation

Number of phases (poles) in an alternating current electrical transmission. Common values are: 1 (single-phase AC), or 3 (three-phase AC). —Sladen (talk) 09:56, 29 September 2017 (UTC)


Discussion
Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment @Sladen: I think you need to move the items from your "planned use" list to the "example" list to show how this would work in practice - would this for example be a property applied to Type 2 connector (Q2335519)? What would the value be in that case? Also, should the values for this property be items rather than numbers? How many different items in wikidata might be likely to need this property? ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:56, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Prerequisite[edit]

   Under discussion
Description a prior event or achievement that a person or team needs to complete before joining or obtaining the item topic, for example a qualifying round of a sports event, a lower-level course in an educational program, or a lower level of a professional qualification
Represents professional qualification (Q3412758), sports qualification (Q2122052), educational qualification
Data type Item
Example
Motivation

Links to introductions of activities ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 15:36, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Comment: If we have such a property, it should be for general use, not just for study or sports. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:49, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose as stated. Sports qualifications (eg FIFA qualifiers, national olympic games qualifiers) are subsidiary sports events that rank sportsmen or teams for participating in the big event. This is very different from obtaining qualifications or certifications to practice a profession, at least because sports qualifiers are for one event whereas professional qualifications are for life (unless you screw up). I can't say what "Qualifications for study in an educational organization" is without an example --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 17:28, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
Educational and professional qualifications are not events but acquired achievements. If a MS program requires a previous BS degree, I could have obtained it any time ago, at any accredited institution, and in any number of related disciplines. They are more static, like competition class (P2094) (applies to sports)
Course prerequisites are firmer relations ("must take course X before taking course Y") but they always allow substitution of "equivalent" courses from this or other university, and often allow alternatives.
@Pigsonthewing: I also think genericity is desirable. Sports qualifiers could be modeled as "event X is a necessary predecessor of event Y". I think this is acceptable simplification from "winning/taking/achieving/graduating from X is a necessary prerequisite to participating in Y".
But you know what, I'd be happy to call this "prerequisite" (aliases "qualification", "qualifier") and apply it for both events and acquired achievements. @ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2: do you agree? I could rewrite the proposal in this way --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 07:44, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support I edited the proposal and support it. See if you're happy with the edits --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 08:04, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@Vladimir Alexiev: Some parts of the new description are unnecessary for the proposal. So I removed them and translated the rest into Arabic.Greetings ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 08:24, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2: Why did you remove the aliases? They are important, please put them back in --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 09:18, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@Vladimir Alexiev: No need for them now.It is better to add them to the property when it is created.Greetings ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 10:06, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
  • @Pigsonthewing: the status of this proposal seems a little confusing to me given the various edits that have gone on here, can you state your current position on the proposal as it stands? ArthurPSmith (talk) 20:04, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
    • Someone - not me - struck my obejection, above. However, I am prepared to withdraw it, please consider me neutral. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:40, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

@Deryck Chan: I understand that you are talking about the importance of qualification. If you create a proposal that has more than one status (more than one property), I am willing to withdraw my proposal and support its new version.Greetings David (talk) 09:20, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

Instagram tag[edit]

   Under discussion
Description string used to identify a topic, on the Instagram image-sharing website
Represents Instagram (Q209330)
Data type External identifier
Allowed values [^\s\/]+
Example
Source https://www.instagram.com/explore/
External links Use in sister projects: [de][en][es][fr][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Formatter URL https://www.instagram.com/explore/tags/$1/
See also
Motivation

Widely used website. Also available in kitten (Q147) or goat (Q2934) flavour. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:59, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 06:48, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question In which sense is this an external identifier? puppies, welpe, chiot all refer to the same concept, so the hashtag does not identify anything, neither is there an authority maintaining these tags. --Pasleim (talk) 17:04, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment. I agree that this is language related and thus should be linked, in the case of puppy, to an item that is about the string of letters puppy, not the actual animal puppy (Q39266). Or am I wrong? Thierry Caro (talk) 17:35, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support by analogy with Twitter hashtag (P2572). Mahir256 (talk) 03:22, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
    Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose Twitter hashtag (P2572) has string datatype, not external id, and per its proposal discussion only sourced hashtags are accepted from official/stable sources, e.g. television programms, official webpages. I'm wondering which source claims that puppy is the correct tag for puppy (Q39266)? Why not puppydog, puppylove, puppystagram, puppys, puppies,小狗, lupetto welpe, welpen, welpenliebe, chiot? --Pasleim (talk) 16:49, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
    I tend to agree that this should be of datatype string as Twitter hashtag (P2572) is, but the given example for this proposal is pretty awful. I have added to this dummy example those hashtags from P2572's property proposal and property talk page, which link to well-populated tags on Instagram. Having done so, however, makes me wonder if there are instances where the Twitter hashtag and the Instagram hashtag are meant to differ. Mahir256 (talk) 00:52, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose with the current datatype but Symbol support vote.svg Support if the datatype is changed to string − Pintoch (talk) 08:11, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
Given that identifiers like this can make it to many items, I think from a usability perspective it's much better to have them listed under the identifier section. Why should it be in the main section @Pintoch, Mahir256:?
@ChristianKl: What is fundamentally different between this proposed property and P2572? Mahir256 (talk) 18:19, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
@Mahir256: I think Twitter hashtag (P2572) would also be better of as external-id. When it comes to looking at existing properties that are similar, there's Quora topic ID (P3417). ChristianKl (talk) 18:38, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support ~nmaia d 00:50, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

usage discussed on page[edit]

   Under discussion
Description link to a discussion on Wikidata about how this item or property is supposed to be used; use this only for stable links
Data type URL
Domain properties and classes (item with subclass of (P279) statement)
Allowed values https?://www.wikidata.org/wiki/(Wikidata|Help)(_talk)?:[^#]+
Example
See also Wikidata:Property proposal/wikidata project
Motivation

I had a discussion on WikidataCon about how it's often hard for new people to find the existing discussions where we talked about how an item or property is supposed to be used. Even for established users it's often hard to find the discussion if you don't know it exists and where to look. This property is supposed to make it easier for people to find existing discussions. ChristianKl (talk) 09:22, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

ChristianKl
ArthurPSmith
d1g
JakobVoss
Jura
Jsamwrites
MisterSynergy
Salgo60

Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Properties ChristianKl (talk) 09:23, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

  • Pictogram voting question.svg Question The URL of a discussion thread changes when it's archived. Is it feasible to automate URL updates with a bot? —ShelleyAdams (talk) 13:33, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
    • That would like need a small change in the bot that does the achieving. On the other hand the topics I used as examples do have stable links, so it would work for them even without code changes. ChristianKl (talk) 14:17, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support I've found the links to property proposal discussions very useful - would you consider replacing that property with this one as it's sort of just a slight generalization of it? ArthurPSmith (talk) 21:17, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
I would prefer not to replace it but make property proposal discussion (P3254) subclass this property as that makes it easier for the user to find the property proposal discussion when they seek it. ChristianKl (talk) 09:37, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:07, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support Could be especially useful for new users and those using properties they're unfamiliar with. —ShelleyAdams (talk) 19:13, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose. It is certainly sometimes difficult to find where a property has been discussed. However, the first place one looks for discussion is typically the talk page, not a statement somewhere down the list on the property page. It would be much more effective and helpful to just add the links to the talk page. --Yair rand (talk) 22:19, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
    • In practice the talk page seldomly contains all the relevant discussions. When it comes to properties it's very easy to change the property documentation template in a way that shows this information when we have this property. ChristianKl (talk) 10:37, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
      • Is it easier, in your opinion, to add statements than to add links to talk pages? Why would the statements be more likely to be up-to-date than the discussion page? --Yair rand (talk) 04:54, 2 November 2017 (UTC)
        • You normally don't add a link without text to a talk page and as a result it's more effort to add the information to the talk page than it is to add the link as a statement. ChristianKl (talk) 15:23, 2 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support in theory the talk page should be the right place but in practice discussion of multiple items and properties is often bundled around WikiProjects and other pages. -- JakobVoss (talk) 11:51, 2 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose This will just lead for items to be filled with dozens of internal links
    --- Jura 22:02, 7 November 2017 (UTC)
If the amount of links get to great it will be always possible to limit the amount of links. I think having multiple links is a lot better than having no way for a new user to find a document like the one that species diplomatic mission are supposed to be labeled. How do you think a user is supposed to find this in the status quo? ChristianKl (talk) 01:26, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose I'm not comfortable with linking to pages with # unless they are archived/stable links. ~nmaia d 00:52, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
    • @NMaia: Do you support the proposal if we add the qualifier that the link has to be stable? ChristianKl (talk) 01:26, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
      • Yeah, apart from that I see no problems. ~nmaia d 02:12, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
      • I'm not sure if it's really better to not allow anchors (or even Topic: sitelinks while we are at it). Either you link discussions (wherever they are located) or you don't. In general, if the discussion has an actual outcome, somehow this should be mentioned in the property description, its constraints and/or talk page.
        --- Jura 08:13, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I assumed the property is going to direct users to best starting point for further documentation of an entity unless it is mainly discussed on its discussion page. In most cases this would be a corresponding WikiProject, not a lengthy discussion thread. Links to section titles with # should be forbidden. -- JakobVoss (talk) 07:01, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
    • I think that would be a good thing to have. There is Wikidata:Property proposal/wikidata project that attempts to do that, but also in an indirect way.
      --- Jura 08:13, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
    • Thanks for the pointer, that proposal looks better, so we should close this here. -- JakobVoss (talk) 08:39, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support I made a similar proposal focusing on WikiProjects alone Wikidata:Property proposal/wikidata project. After changing its scope, I feel that the proposal is similar to this proposal (more generic). John Samuel 10:11, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose This is not structured data; it belongs in the propety documentation template; or a similar template on item talk pages. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:38, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
  • @Pigsonthewing: Currently, this data just isn't recorded. Having a property would make it easy for users to add link. I don't think that introducing a new template item talk page would result in this useful information actually being available to users. ChristianKl () 15:36, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose. This is documentation, not structured metadata. This information belongs on the property talk page. Deryck Chan (talk) 15:24, 7 December 2017 (UTC)

Alternative text[edit]

   Under discussion
Description A text alternative of the displayed image
Represents Alt attribute (Q1067764)
Data type Monolingual text
Template parameter "alt" in most infoboxes
Domain Qualifier of image (P18), logo image (P154) and other image-specific properties
Example Earth (Q2)image (P18) → "The Blue Marble photograph of Earth, taken by the Apollo 17 mission. The Arabian peninsula, Africa and Madagascar lie in the upper half of the disc, whereas Antarctica is at the bottom."
Motivation

Alt tags in their most basic form describe what is shown in an image - they are the equivalent of media legend (P2096) except they say what the image contains rather than what it displays. They are essential for people using a screen reader (Q1328864) to access a page, and as such they are a fundamental part of using images in Wikidata-driven infoboxes. This concept was previously discussed at Wikidata:Property proposal/alt, and the main arguments against it were "but it depends on context" (which it does a bit, but not as much as media legend (P2096) does - and having some description is much better than no description!) and "Commons isn't ready yet" (which is fine, but we need this *now* in infoboxes, and we can migrate it over to Structured Commons later if needed). As such, I think this needs rediscussing. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 00:24, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment@Mike Peel: What is the difference between this and media legend (P2096)?Thank you David (talk) 16:41, 19 November 2017 (UTC)
    • @ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2: They are two different things. The media legend provides a caption for the image, the alt tag describes what is in the image. So in the example I gave above, the second sentence would not appear in the media caption, but can in the alt tag. If you couldn't see an image (e.g., it doesn't load, or you're using a screen reader), often the captions aren't sufficient to understand what the image would have shown - that's where an alt tag steps in. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 16:58, 19 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support I don't buy the "depends on context" argument - a good "alt" tag is intended to provide a textual description of an image; it may be a thousand words, but it should describe the image sufficiently that a person who cannot see the image would understand what was in it, no matter whether the whole or just a part of the image was relevant in a given context. ArthurPSmith (talk) 01:07, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose, again. Ambiguous, context dependent, subjective, unstructured data which is different for every language. --Yair rand (talk) 22:02, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
    @Yair rand: In the same way as media legend (P2096) is? We have a number of other examples where your statement could apply (e.g., aliases, descriptions), I can't see why we can have those and not this, particularly given the accessibility benefits of alt tags. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 21:22, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
  • @Mike Peel: I was looking at your example case to think about it some more - is your intention to use this as a qualifier on a image (P18) statement? If so there would always be a context - in the example case the image is a representation of the Earth, not some part of it or the Apollo missions, or whatever else it might be used for. If the intention is rather to somehow attach this property directly to the image, then I don't think we are able to do that anyway right now, as images (from Commons at least) do not have wikidata items. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:54, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
    @ArthurPSmith: Yes, I was only expecting this would be useful as a qualifier for P18 (and other image-specific properties, e.g. logo image (P154)), and personally I'm only interested in using it for alt tags in infoboxes. I'm not proprosing that we start having Wikidata items solely for images! Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 21:22, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose My main concern the last time was that nobody wanted to invest the time to look at how the property is labeled/described elsewhere to make a case of how we should name it. Naming it "Alternative text" which clearly violates our naming conventions by starting with a capital letter suggest to me that little thought went into the creation of this proposal. I'm willing to change my opinion if someone actually looks at prior art and makes the case that a specific name is the best one.ChristianKl () 19:40, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

key press[edit]

   Under discussion
Description keyboard shortcut sequence / Key entry sequence
Data type String
Example
Robot and gadget jobs Requires qualifier platform (P400)
See also {{Key press}}
Motivation

So while looking at w:Trademark symbol, I noticed it included Windows Alt key codes. I considered standardizing using an Infobox, but Wikidata seems like the Right Way to Do It™. —Dispenser (talk) 00:46, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment @Dispenser:How to enter "{{key press}}" as a statement?Thank you David (talk) 16:45, 19 November 2017 (UTC)
    • I've rendered with formatting templates, but should probably define a micro markup language. Pilcrow (Q331864) would be entered as Ctrl+K, P, I. —Dispenser (talk) 20:31, 19 November 2017 (UTC)
  • I take it you would represent the Platform with a platform (P400) qualifier? That should probably be a required qualifier if this new property is created. Do you have a good source for all these? ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:49, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
    • Yes, it should. I've struck Konami Code from the examples list since its not specific enough. Examples listed were pulled from their English Wikipedia article. —Dispenser (talk) 21:37, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Apparently, ALT+0153 only works on numeric (side) keypads; not all windows machines. Beside that, I'd rather see a solution using items than strings. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:24, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
  • The datatype is set to string. The example however contains Wikitext templates. Is that intentional? I'm not sure how you want to use "platform". I'm not sure how the examples are currently supposed to look. Maybe setup the examples on https://test.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Main_Page ? ChristianKl () 14:58, 22 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Output looks interesting, but how could we do that?
    --- Jura 19:42, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

disputed in source[edit]

   Under discussion
Data type Item
Example [...]
Motivation

Related to statement disputed by (P1310), which is used as a qualifier. The proposed property is to be used in the sources section, together with other source properties, to provide a full reference. The property would function as a counterpart to stated in (P248).

See also discussion at Property_talk:P1310#Qualifier or reference ?, WD:Property_proposal/Archive/22#P1310. Pinging @Zolo, Micru:. Yair rand (talk) 22:15, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support this makes sense to me. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:38, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support Micru (talk) 20:38, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
  • I like the basic idea but it needs a description and an example. ChristianKl () 11:32, 22 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment tricky thing. Somehow I think the "disputed by" statement with its sources should be a separate one.
    --- Jura 11:39, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I have the feeling that this is not the right solution (although I don't really have any better idea in mind). Instinctively we need a way to flag an entire reference as supporting the statement disputed by (P1310) qualifier. If I understand the proposal correctly, this would only work for references which would normally have used stated in (P248). But what happens in the case of a simple reference URL (P854)? Do we also need a negative counterpart to this one? − Pintoch (talk) 16:36, 14 December 2017 (UTC)

derivative work[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Object is a notable work that is derived from subject
Represents derivative work (Q836950)
Data type Item
Domain subject and object are works of human creativity
Example
Planned use Initial use in set of items for the pictures released under a GLAM initiative here Comparative Album of the City of São Paulo 1862-1887 (Q43484823); most of those pictures derived many iconic paintings in Brazilian historic paintings.
See also based on (P144)
Motivation

As we have already the Property:P144, a property for "the work(s) used as basis for subject", I would like to propose the inverse one: a property for "the work(s) derived of this item/work". Sturm (talk) 20:36, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support. I think the name of this property should be "derivative work", as described by derivative work (Q836950). Deryck Chan (talk) 00:06, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:35, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Could you express the case for having the inverse property? ChristianKl () 18:48, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
    • @ChristianKl: I can imagine somebody wanting to make a magic infobox called "Notable derivative works" to be added to articles about a creative work. Trying to query the inverse would be incredibly computationally expensive; having this new property also allows Wikidata editors to use rank to curate what it considers important derivative works. Deryck Chan (talk) 12:35, 4 December 2017 (UTC)
      • Symbol support vote.svg Support I think the need to curate which works are notable enough to be listed justifies the separate property. ChristianKl () 12:37, 4 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support This would make finding derivative works a lot easier than looking through whatlinkshere / searching around the topic. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 23:24, 3 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support It is the reciprocal property to P144. To some extent, it is no different than saying that an individual is the father of someone else, and that this someone else is the daughter of this individual. They are reciprocally bonded.  – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Joalpe (talk • contribs).
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment if it's meant to be an inverse, shouldn't be called the same? If it's to be limited to notable works, maybe "basis for notable works:"? Could the item for the building depicted in the painting have that too? (probably not, as "depicted by" could be sufficient"). For translation, I guess we already have a dedicated property as well. What happens to statements that use "inspired by"? Would this be an inverse for that too?
    --- Jura 18:50, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose. An inverse of based on (P144) adds nothing, and makes the data harder to maintain and less accurate. --Yair rand (talk) 00:54, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

complies with[edit]

   Under discussion
Description the product or work complies with a certain norm or passes a test
Data type Item
Domain technical standard (Q317623), work (Q386724),
Example
Source specific to the norm or test
See also
Motivation

Inspired by this request. There's currently no good way to model this kind of statement. MB-one (talk) 18:52, 2 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 19:00, 2 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Is there a reason not to call this "complies with norm" but have the (norm/test)? ChristianKl () 19:10, 2 December 2017 (UTC)
    • The idea is to make the property more widely applicable. But the label is certainly open for discussion. --MB-one (talk) 19:42, 2 December 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support how about just labeling this "satisfies" to indicate the item satisfies the constraints of whatever the target item is? ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:37, 4 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support Marked as ready, with the simpler label suggested by Arthur and Christian. − Pintoch (talk) 15:53, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose Using this with Bechdel test (Q4165246) means that we can only show when the norm is passed and not when it isn't. If we want a solution that can speak well about the Bechdel test (Q4165246) we should spend more time on the drawing board to think about how this will be modeled. I would also appreciate links to prior art because there's likely prior art and it would make sense to copy the wording.
It's worth to spend the time to debate a name for an item like this to get it right. ChristianKl () 16:03, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
You'd have to name a property something like "compliance with" and require a qualifier to specify the "yes" or "no" value; maybe rating (P4271) could be the qualifier? ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:31, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
Perhaps there could be a separate target item for noncompliance to the Bechdel test, which could then be linked to Bechdel test somehow? --Yair rand (talk) 00:57, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
Oh, yes that works. @ChristianKl: just use this with an item labeled "fails Bechdel test" or something like that, and it should be clear what the meaning is. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:04, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
To me "complies with" "fails Bechdel test" seems like a very forced construction. If you advocate such a forced construction, you should at the minimum start by looking at whether there are already better solutions out there that are used in other structured data projects.
"It should be clear what the meaning is" maybe, but that's not the standard. The meaning is not supposed to rest in the words of the label of the item. ChristianKl () 18:24, 15 December 2017 (UTC)
@ChristianKl: This property is intended to be usable for many tests and norms. Bechdel test (Q4165246) is just one example. Having a special property just for this test, wouldn't make this property obsolete. --MB-one (talk) 09:50, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
I don't think that caring about noting when a test isn't passed is unique to Bechdel test (Q4165246). ChristianKl () 14:00, 14 December 2017 (UTC)

Wikimedia import URL[edit]

Description URL of source to indicate the page or revision of an import source from another Wikimedia project (except actual references, such as WikiSource source texts). Use instead of "reference URL" (P854)
Data type URL
Example Taiwan (Q865) FIPS 10-4 (countries and regions) (P901) TW Reference → https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_FIPS_country_codes&oldid=588315474 / imported from (P143) English Wikipedia (Q328) (to replace the current practice)
Motivation

Of strong wish of Wikipedia projects is that when they import our data for infoboxes they want to make sure that they don't import circular references but can be sure that we link to external references. As a result the usage of reference URL (P854) to link internally is problematic. When it's used that way it gets harder to automatically filter out internal references. ChristianKl () 12:02, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support per my comments at Wikidata:Property_proposal/wikimedia_revision_identifier.
    --- Jura 19:31, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
    • Note following the new sample: Symbol support vote.svg Support the creation of the property, but Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose the change from the use of "imported from" as qualifier.
      --- Jura 17:55, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
  • I don't understand how this property would be used. Could you provide an example? Would this be equivalent to imported from (P143)? --Yair rand (talk) 23:43, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:16, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support we definitely should do this. Can we add a constraint on "reference URL" to not allow wikimedia links? ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:57, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
  • I have already added a constraint for reference URL (P854) for Wikipedia links. It would be great if someone with more regex experience writes one that catches other Wikimedia domains as well. There are likely different ways to write the constraint and it would make sense to write it in a performance optimized way. ChristianKl () 17:40, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
You are right, for some reason I typed 31 instead of 143. It should obviously be imported from (P143) in the example. located in the administrative territorial entity (P131) is also not appropriate ;) ChristianKl () 11:50, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
Not sure what I was thinking when I wrote P131 lol. I agree P131 is wrong too. Maybe I meant 143 but I really don't remember what I was thinking. Deryck Chan (talk) 16:14, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment maybe "Wikimedia source URL" would be the better label. "URL" for consistency with "reference URL", "source" as it's the actual source, not just a reference that states the same.
    --- Jura 11:54, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
    • Okay, I renamed it into "Wikimedia source URL". ChristianKl () 13:01, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Following Wikidata:Project_chat#Help:Sources_does_not_mention_Wikisource, to avoid misunderstandings, we should probably exclude explicitly Wikisource source texts in the description. Maybe "import" could go into the label as well.
    --- Jura 20:20, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
    • I changed to "Wikimedia import URL" and added into the description that it's not to be used with WikiSource. ChristianKl () 00:33, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
      • I tried to phrase is slightly differently. Wikisource also has author pages with dates of birth/death that are imported like dates from Wikipedia.
        --- Jura 08:05, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
        • I'm happy with that new wording. ChristianKl () 17:26, 11 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Why not combination of imported from (P143) and reference URL (P854)? Matěj Suchánek (talk) 11:01, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
    • @Matěj Suchánek: Having that combination means that we can't set a constraint that reference URL (P854) is not supposed to be used with Wikipedia and we end up with the status quo reference URL (P854) is used with Wikipedia links because there's no easy way for a new user who hasn't read our discussions to know that they are not supposed to use it that way. ChristianKl () 17:26, 11 December 2017 (UTC)

@ChristianKl, Matěj Suchánek, Jura1, Deryck Chan, ArthurPSmith, Yair rand: done: Wikimedia import URL (P4656)Pintoch (talk) 15:32, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

  • @Pintoch:, thanks, but could you use the label from the proposal?
    --- Jura 15:34, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
  • @Pintoch: Thanks. Just for completion, unfortunately the tool uses the name of the page (Wikimedia reference link) as the label instead of the label that we agreed on in the property discussion (Wikimedia import URL). ChristianKl () 15:36, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Yeah, I'm learning the ropes! :) But I have the feeling that the creation process could be much more automated. If I get very bored, I might write a tool for that (take the proposal template, and do most of the required edits automatically), because it's a bit tedious and not very creative… − Pintoch (talk) 15:39, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
I fully agree that it would make sense to automate more of the process. ChristianKl () 15:47, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
np. There is a bot that moves some of it from talk to statement.
--- Jura 15:51, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

rationale for inference[edit]

   Under discussion
Description used as reference; used along with P3452 to explain how the inferenced was made
Represents rationale for inference (Q45369412)
Data type Item
Allowed values subclasses of Q45369412
Example Karl Bardili (Q1036943) child (P40) Burckhard Bardili (Q1010392) References: inferred from (P3452) Burckhard Bardili (Q1010392)P40 deduced from P22 as inverse relationship (Q45369615)
See also inferred from (P3452)
Motivation

Currently, inferred from (P3452) is used by bots to make it clear from which items they take information. One of the big advantages of having this property is that this means that stated in (P248) is less likely to be misused for refering to information contained in an item instead of information that's contained in the entity represented by an item.

On of the drawbacks of the current usage of inferred from (P3452) is that the information about how the bot made it's inference often isn't recorded. This property would allow a bot owner to optionally record information about why the bot made it's inference.

Having this property will also allow us to move existing constraint violating items that use stated in (P248) as a reference to using inferred from (P3452) while noting that we make that switch explicitely. This means that Wikipedians won't have to import circular references that are created by misusing stated in (P248).ChristianKl () 21:52, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

LTI Korea Library ID[edit]

   Under discussion
Description identifier for a Korean writer, book, and event in Literature Translation Institute of Korea Library (library.klti.or.kr)
Represents Literature Translation Institute of Korea (Q6647741)
Data type External identifier
Allowed values [1-9]\d*
Example
Source http://library.klti.or.kr
External links Use in sister projects: [de][en][es][fr][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Formatter URL http://library.klti.or.kr/node/$1
Robot and gadget jobs LTI Korea Library ID
Motivation

This would allow a better coverage of Korean novelists, poets, books, and events. Sawol (talk) 06:49, 14 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:45, 14 December 2017 (UTC)