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Wikidata:Property proposal/Person

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Property proposal: Generic Authority control Person Organization
Event Creative work Term Space
Place Sports Sister projects
Economics Transportation Natural science Property metadata

See also[edit]


This page is for the proposal of new properties.

Before proposing a property
  1. Check if the property already exists by looking at Wikidata:List of properties (manual list) and Special:ListProperties.
  2. Check if the property was previously proposed or is on the pending list.
  3. Check if you can give a similar label and definition as an existing Wikipedia infobox parameter, or if it can be matched to an infobox, to or from which data can be transferred automatically.
  4. Select the right datatype for the property.
  5. Start writing the documentation based on the preload form below and add it in the appropriate section.

Creating the property

  1. Once consensus is reached, change status=ready on the template, to attract the attention of a property creator.
  2. Creation can be done 1 week after the proposal, by a property creator or an administrator.
  3. See steps when creating properties.


On this page, old discussions are archived. An overview of all archives can be found at this page's archive index. The current archive is located at 2017/12.

Persons[edit]

Forgotten Opera Singers ID[edit]

   Under discussion
Description identifier for a singe on the Forgotten Opera Singers website
Data type External identifier
Domain opera singer
Example Graziella Pareto (Q3115895)2012/04/graziella-pareto-barcelona-1889-roma
External links Use in sister projects: [de][en][es][fr][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Formatter URL http://forgottenoperasingers.blogspot.com/$1.html
Motivation

I have noticed that the New York Times has been using this website, and now I have been using it for Wikipedia.  – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk • contribs) at 14:52, 7 October 2017‎ (UTC).

Discussion

co-consecrator[edit]

   Under discussion
Description The bishops other than the principal consecrator who partake in the consecration of another bishop.
Represents co-consecrator (Q18442828) and principal co-consecrator (Q18442822)
Data type Item
Template parameter "co-consecrators" in en:template:ordination
Allowed values Q template
Example Francis (Q450675)Ubaldo Calabresi (Q7485441) & Emilio Ogñénovich (Q983902)
Planned use I plan to use the property on the items of Catholic, Orthodox, and Anglican bishops and then edit en:Template:Ordination (which I have been slowly making Wikidata-enabled) to call values from this parameter, a feature that is currently not possible with the existing properties. For now, I intend to use the property as a qualifier of consecration (Q125375)
Motivation

There are currently two items co-consecrator (Q18442828) and principal co-consecrator (Q18442822) for this proposed property. I am trying to enable en:Template:Ordination (and eventually en:Template:Infobox Christian leader) to be able to call the value of this parameter. This is part of my work to make the whole template able to be supplied from Wikidata without using any local parameters. There is a structural need for the parameter. Also, as a general matter, it would be worthwhile information to have on Wikidata, since it is a central element of most Christian person-related infoboxes on the English Wikipedia and other languages. There is already a consecrator (P1598) property, so this proposed property would complement that. Ergo Sum (talk) 12:52, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose This property feels to narrow, and I see no argument that has been made why this can't be covered by a more generel property. ChristianKl (talk) 12:56, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Why not use preferred rank for the consecrator and normal rank for the co-consecrators? Or perhaps series ordinal (P1545) if you want to enforce a further ordering? Mahir256 (talk) 06:01, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
    • @Mahir256: I've thought about both of those options, but neither is compatible with the Wikipedia module that calls Wikidata info. Really, the only way to do it is to have a designated property that can accept values, especially in this case, where there would be multiple values entered for this one parameter on a given item. It also does not allow the co-consecrator info to be included as a qualifier of consecration (Q125375). Ergo Sum (talk) 00:39, 26 October 2017 (UTC)

Prerequisite[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Prerequisite event or achievement needed for, for example participation in a sports event, study in educational program, or practice of a profession
Represents professional qualification (Q3412758), sports qualification (Q2122052), educational qualification
Data type Item
Example
Motivation

Links to introductions of activities ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 15:36, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Comment: If we have such a property, it should be for general use, not just for study or sports. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:49, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose as stated. Sports qualifications (eg FIFA qualifiers, national olympic games qualifiers) are subsidiary sports events that rank sportsmen or teams for participating in the big event. This is very different from obtaining qualifications or certifications to practice a profession, at least because sports qualifiers are for one event whereas professional qualifications are for life (unless you screw up). I can't say what "Qualifications for study in an educational organization" is without an example --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 17:28, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
Educational and professional qualifications are not events but acquired achievements. If a MS program requires a previous BS degree, I could have obtained it any time ago, at any accredited institution, and in any number of related disciplines. They are more static, like competition class (P2094) (applies to sports)
Course prerequisites are firmer relations ("must take course X before taking course Y") but they always allow substitution of "equivalent" courses from this or other university, and often allow alternatives.
@Pigsonthewing: I also think genericity is desirable. Sports qualifiers could be modeled as "event X is a necessary predecessor of event Y". I think this is acceptable simplification from "winning/taking/achieving/graduating from X is a necessary prerequisite to participating in Y".
But you know what, I'd be happy to call this "prerequisite" (aliases "qualification", "qualifier") and apply it for both events and acquired achievements. @ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2: do you agree? I could rewrite the proposal in this way --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 07:44, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
Symbol support vote.svg Support I edited the proposal and support it. See if you're happy with the edits --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 08:04, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@Vladimir Alexiev: Some parts of the new description are unnecessary for the proposal. So I removed them and translated the rest into Arabic.Greetings ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 08:24, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2: Why did you remove the aliases? They are important, please put them back in --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 09:18, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
@Vladimir Alexiev: No need for them now.It is better to add them to the property when it is created.Greetings ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2 (talk) 10:06, 3 October 2017 (UTC)
  • @Pigsonthewing: the status of this proposal seems a little confusing to me given the various edits that have gone on here, can you state your current position on the proposal as it stands? ArthurPSmith (talk) 20:04, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
    • Someone - not me - struck my obejection, above. However, I am prepared to withdraw it, please consider me neutral. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:40, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

Consecrator of[edit]

   Under discussion
Description The persons a Christian bishop, acting as principal or sole consecrator, have consecrated as bishops. Inverse of consecrator (P1598).
Data type Item
Template parameter "bishop 1" — "bishop 180" in en:Template:Ordination
Allowed values Q template or text
Example Timothy M. Dolan (Q225823)
Planned use I intend to use the property on the item pages of various Christian bishops (Catholic, Anglican, Lutheran) and later on for other Christian denominations. Immediately, I intend to have values from this property called by en:Template:Ordination in the "Episcopal succession" section to completely enable Wikidata-fed data in the template.
Motivation

This property would be the inverse of consecrator (P1598). I am enabling en:Template:Ordination to call data values from Wikidata. The template is currently unable to fill its "Episcopal succession" section because there is no property on Wikidata that can accept values for it. In addition to its inter-wiki structural role, the information is useful for many Christians, including Catholics, Anglicans, Lutherans, etc. for indicating apostolic succession in the historic episcopate. This property was proposed in the past, but there is now a structural need, so it can be used in the template for further Wikidata integration in English Wikipedia. Ergo Sum (talk) 21:47, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • What's special about Christian bishop's, so that the relationship is qualitatively different from other religions and also from other positions in the Christian church that appoint people.
Apart from that you can likely do a reverse lookup of consecrator (P1598) to get data from your template. ChristianKl () 16:20, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
  • @ChristianKl: I'm not aware of a bishop analogue in other religions. If there is one, then perhaps this proposed property could be revised. It expresses something different than appointment. For example, the Pope appoints each bishop, but a particular bishop consecrates them.
As for the reverse lookup, could you explain what exactly that is? If you mean having the template call the values from different items for each parameter, then that would be a very expensive call, which I don't believe is allowed by infobox-based templates. Also, the Enwiki-Wikidata module does not support that. Ergo Sum (talk) 18:32, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
What exactly does it mean to consecrate? ChristianKl () 18:34, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
@ChristianKl: Consecration is a religious ceremony by which a bishop or group of bishops makes someone else a bishop. It involves ritual and is a spiritual process, not an administrative one. Ergo Sum (talk) 18:36, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
Are you saying that Christianity is the only religion that has religious ceremonies in which someone who's a X or a group of X's makes another person an X? ChristianKl () 13:18, 25 November 2017 (UTC)
There could very well be other religions that do that, but I do not know of them. To my knowledge, neither Judaism nor Islam raise individuals to certain positions through religious ceremonies. I am not sure how Hindu priests are appointed, but it could be through a religious ceremony. If you have a suggestion of a broader term that could encompass these (as well as ordinations for Christian priests), I'm all ears. Ergo Sum (talk) 17:47, 25 November 2017 (UTC)

I have proposed role as a new property, which if passed, would diminish the need for this property. Role seems more generally applicable, so I would appreciate if you could weigh in there as well. Ergo Sum (talk) 06:07, 25 November 2017 (UTC)

Service number[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Service number given to the subject by a military organisation
Represents service number (Q7455778)
Data type String
Domain human (Q5)
Allowed values [^\s\/]+
Example Douglas Bader (Q348780) → 26151
Source Various external references and historic sources
See also United States Armed Forces service number (P2028)
Motivation

A military figure's service number is intended to be an identifier for them. It is usually part of the historical record, particularly for people killed in action and buried in military cemeteries, or who received military awards. In some contexts it can even be easier to identify a person from a number than a name.

We currently have United States Armed Forces service number (P2028), but this is very narrowly defined - it only applies to US personnel under the various 1918-1974 numbering schemes. The sheer range of different schemes used over the years make it impractical to create a lot of specific-use properties like this; a more generic property would be usable on all people, perhaps with a military branch (P241) qualifier where it is necessary to clarify which numbering system was used.

This proposal comes out of a discussion on project chat last month; ping @Pigsonthewing, Jura1, Hsarrazin, Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ): who commented there or on the P2028 proposal. Andrew Gray (talk) 23:18, 4 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • How about converting "United States Armed Forces service number (P2028)" into a more general service number field? I had planned to create a bot to crawl through the United States Armed Forces service database but I never got around to learning how to create one. --RAN (talk) 23:56, 4 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:29, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support, but only if we cannot a) repurpose P2028, which would be a better option (it is currently used on only eleven items; or b) use catalog code (P528)/ catalog (P972), which is logically equivalent. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 07:47, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • As noted in the earlier discussion, I don't think catalog code (P528)/ catalog (P972) are appropriate - they would need us to know the qualifiers used in advance in order to write queries to find service numbers, and this wouldn't be practical. Andrew Gray (talk) 21:50, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol oppose vote.svg Oppose I would prefer to repurpose P2028. In any case, I don't think this should be used without a qualifier as suggested in the example. ChristianKl () 16:31, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • I would also prefer to repurpose P2028, but there was opposition to that... Regarding qualifiers, I think these would probably be advisable, though perhaps in some cases a "numbering system" property qualifier would be more appropriate than P241. Andrew Gray (talk) 21:50, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment for the current sample (Douglas Bader (Q348780) → 26151) to work, the label would probably need to be "British (something) Service number". Is that consider a social security number?
    --- Jura 19:37, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • The point is that it could be a generic service number property; we could use qualifiers to indicate what it was for (in this case, the RAF). And no, it is not a social security number of any kind. Andrew Gray (talk) 21:50, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
  • The example doesn't use any qualifiers. If you want to propose a way to express this information that includes qualifiers, I would advocate to use corresponding examples. ChristianKl () 14:12, 6 December 2017 (UTC)

artist exhibition at[edit]

   Under discussion
Description Museums and galleries where an artist's work has been exhibited.
Represents exhibition (Q464980)
Data type Item
Domain artists
Example Clifford Owens (Q17183980)Contemporary Arts Museum Houston (Q93691), MoMA PS1 (Q1139848), Cornerhouse (Q2997538)
Planned use add to contemporary artist biographies
See also exhibition history (P608) for exhibition of single artworks
Motivation

For museums and galleries where an artist's work has been exhibited solo or as part of a small group. This is meant to be used exhaustively only for medium-prominence artists - for very high-prominence historic artists with hundreds of exhibitions, only the most prominent shows should be included.Pharos (talk) 23:48, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Is there a reason not to use significant event (P793) > exhibition (Q464980), qualified with location (museum) and dates? We’d want to add exhibition (Q464980) to class key event (Q2245405). - PKM (talk) 00:13, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

I guess you could, as you could replace many other properties with significant event (P793) that way, but I think it's a relevant enough property for many artists, that it is valuable to make it easy to add more directly.--Pharos (talk) 02:54, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 07:22, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I think this is a case of "Wikipedia-think" in that a common section in artist biographies list the museums/exhibitions showing their work. On Wikidata we do this the other way around, by making an item for the museum or exhibition and then an item for the work and linking the work to the creator. So this information is inferred from the actual work shown, and the context in which it is shown in adds relevance to the artist in ways a simple statement about the venues could. I understand that we could have more interesting workflows resulting from this however (interested Wikidatans could try to find more info about exhibitions/museums if they found such info in the item on an artist they like). I am not convinced this should reside in a (potentially huge) property field as list of items. Jane023 (talk) 11:29, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

Identifiers[edit]

Names[edit]

patronym or matronym[edit]

   Under discussion
Description patronym or matronym of a person
Represents patronymic (Q110874), matronymic (Q1076664)
Data type Item
Domain human (Q5)
Example
Motivation

We already have patronym or matronym (P2976) which is for linking given names to equivalent p/matronyms, but no property for linking humans to their patronym or matronym. If this proposal is approved, I propose that P2976 be renamed "patronym or matronym equivalent of name", or similar. Yair rand (talk) 23:27, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

@Vladimir Alexiev: Because they are different types of relationships. A name can have an equivalent name in another category, and a person can also simply have on of their names. The data needs to be structured. --Yair rand (talk) 21:57, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
@Yair rand: Why are they different types of relations? Both describe the p/matronym of something, be that a name or a person. A good practice in ontology design is to let props vary by meaning and range, but not by domain, to avoid combinatorial explosion. Eg schema.org follows this principle widely. --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 05:50, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
People can be referred to by a patronym. Given names are not referred to by patronyms. Given names have equivalents in other forms of names. People do not have name equivalents. The only thing the two relationships have in common is that the targets share a type. I don't think that's really enough to share a property. --Yair rand (talk) 21:03, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
Discussion

Symbol wait.svg Wait till we have a description that tells people who don't know what a patronym or matronym is what the property is about. ChristianKl () 19:11, 7 December 2017 (UTC)

  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment maybe this would work better with two separate properties, one for Icelandic, another one for Russian. (or at least for names that work like each of these).
    --- Jura 19:13, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
    @Jura1: There are dozens of nations and cultures that use or have used patronyms and/or matronyms. I don't think it would be helpful to make separate properties for each of these... --Yair rand (talk) 22:11, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

Careers[edit]

Other[edit]

National Governors Association biography[edit]

   Under discussion
Description National Governors Association biography
Represents National Governors Association (Q494210)
Data type External identifier
Example Edward Irving Edwards (Q436902)Governor Edward Irving Edwards
William Livingston (Q878535)William Livingston
Source National Governors Association website
Planned use Attach to every US governor
Formatter URL https://www.nga.org/cms/home/governors/past-governors-bios/$1.default.html
Motivation

Another source for biographical information. See Governor Edward Irving Edwards for example  – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk • contribs) at 00:30, 12 September 2017‎ (UTC).

Discussion
As Andy pointed out I malformed the formatter, sorry, can you try again. --RAN (talk) 16:47, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
@Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ): "https://www.nga.org/cms/home/governors/past-governors-bios/Governor Edward Irving Edwards.default.html" is no better. Do you really intend that long string Andy listed as the identifier? ArthurPSmith (talk) 20:37, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment Just a technical note: It seems that URL pattern varies. Some have really short urls for which https://www.nga.org/cms/$1 could work. Maybe eventually the longer ones will have that format. Alternatively one could go for URL datatype.
    --- Jura 20:00, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

@Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ): Currently the formatter Url doesn't produce the links you listed in the examples and doesn't work. Given that you haven't reacted to the request by ArthurPSmith, do you still want this property? ChristianKl () 21:47, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

It looks like they have changed their URL format since I started the nomination. Let me look at their new system and make sure that the transition is complete for their entire archive. --RAN (talk) 05:19, 6 December 2017 (UTC)
You could add the old ones too and just deprecated them once new ones come out.
--- Jura 19:00, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Url format[edit]

The url format is complicated, but a bot should be able to load them to Wikidata.

SAT score[edit]

   Ready Create
Description score that the person achieved on the United States' SAT, a test taken by most applicants for higher education
Represents SAT (Q334113)
Data type Quantity
Allowed units subclasses of SAT score (Q44209670)
Example Ben Bernanke (Q201795) → 1590 Unit: SAT score of 1971 (Q44212908)
Motivation

SAT scores are an interesting statistic and there's currently no good structured database to look them up. While in many cases the scores aren't public there are many people for whom the scores can be sourced from public sources. ChristianKl () 22:35, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support ok, as long as there's some way to verify these. This is another property that might be considered private information for living people... ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:38, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
    • I agree that it makes sense to add it to the list. ChristianKl () 17:41, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Symbol support vote.svg Support David (talk) 17:27, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Pictogram voting comment.svg Comment I am looking this property from a privacy perspective. The names of top scorers (in exams) usually appear in newspapers/official websites. Adding such information from official sources may not be an issue. However, clear guidelines must be provided before its use. If there is a consensus, this property can be further generalized to 'score in exam', where qualifiers can be used to specify the exam, SAT (or others). John Samuel 11:46, 2 December 2017 (UTC)