Wikidata:Property proposal/Find New Zealand Artists iD
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Find New Zealand Artists ID[edit]
Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control
| Description | Identifier for artists listed in Find New Zealand Artists online database |
|---|---|
| Data type | External identifier |
| Domain | people |
| Example | |
| Source | https://www.findnzartists.org.nz |
| External links | Use in sister projects: [ar] • [de] • [en] • [es] • [fr] • [he] • [it] • [ja] • [ko] • [nl] • [pl] • [pt] • [ru] • [sv] • [vi] • [zh] • [commons] • [species] • [wd] • [en.wikt] • [fr.wikt]. |
| Mix'n'match | 2439 |
| Planned use | Mix'n'match of 18,000+ person names of New Zealand artists |
| Number of IDs in source | >18,000 |
| Expected completeness | always incomplete (Q21873886) |
| Formatter URL | https://findnzartists.org.nz/artist/$1/ |
| See also | Alexander Turnbull Library ID (P6683), Auckland Art Gallery artist ID (P3372) |
Motivation[edit]
Find New Zealand Artists is a database of artists' names drawn from a range of online and printed sources. It is reliably and regularly maintained by staff at Christchurch Art Gallery (Q5109058) and Auckland Art Gallery Toi o Tāmaki (Q4819492).
Discussion[edit]
Support Ratso56 5:10, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- The FindNZArtists original identifier is the URL as per Linked Data, not simply a numeric ID. Refer Linked Data Principles #1 [[1]] Ratso56 (talk) 21:14, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- But this is usually expressed with the fields formatter URL (P1630) and format as a regular expression (P1793), isn't it? Identifiers are usually a single number, not a URL. I'll re-edit it. —Giantflightlessbirds (talk) 21:44, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- Only if the identifier is truly a number, e.g. ISBN? But the entire point of Linked Data is that the URI is the identifier, so the best datatype I could find is URL. What I'd like to express is that the identifier is a URI, and it follows the format https://findnzartists.org.nz/artist/{nnnn}/ where nnnn are digits. The discussion at https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Property_proposal/WordLift_ID is relevant, but the identifier is the URI, not the numbers.Ratso56 (talk) 23:03, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- I've noticed the IDs have been changed to numeric; that is incorrect. The IDs are URIs, of the form https://findnzartists.org.nz/artist/9785/ as originally proposed. If you request an ID via the API [2] the JSON returned includes
"id": "https://findnzartists.org.nz/artist/9785/"--Ratso56 (talk) 00:05, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support David (talk) 07:02, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support Dilnotsladden (talk) 21:26, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support Wordlift is unusual. This is much more normal, and is best done with the number. --99of9 (talk) 00:09, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- @99of9: Thanks for the indication of support. The question for me is whether Wikidata supports URIs as identifiers per Linked Data principles. Just because the URI happens to have numeric digits in it, doesn't mean the ID is a number, and the edits to date distort the original intent of the property proposal. My interpretation is that datatype=URL or perhaps datatype=external-id is the best way to do that, and I'm concerned that rewriting the ID down to numeric digits moves us away from the linked data approach aspired to, and will actually break tools if URIs are substituted for $1 per the Formatter URL pattern.--Ratso56 (talk) 00:19, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- @Ratso56: To be clear, I support the edited version, not the original. The way you get the URI is to combine the formatter URL with the value of the property. It does not matter whether the identifier value is a number, or other digits. I'm not sure what you mean by breaking tools. The way this is now shown is consistent with the vast majority of external identifier properties. --99of9 (talk)
- @99of9: But the identifier is not the number! For linked data the identifier is the URI, as per WordLift, which is another example of using Linked Data. The majority of external identifiers are not yet URIs, because they are not yet linked data.--Ratso56 (talk) 00:50, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- @Ratso56: welcome to Wikidata. This is how we roll here. We store the identifier and use that the generate the URL and the URI. See for example Union List of Artist Names ID (P245). For Vincent van Gogh (Q5582) has id 500115588. This will generate the URL http://vocab.getty.edu/page/ulan/500115588 and the URI http://vocab.getty.edu/ulan/500115588 . Check out the RDF which contains the URI as <wdtn:P245 rdf:resource="http://vocab.getty.edu/ulan/500115588"/>. Does that address your concerns? Multichill (talk) 07:54, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- @99of9: But the identifier is not the number! For linked data the identifier is the URI, as per WordLift, which is another example of using Linked Data. The majority of external identifiers are not yet URIs, because they are not yet linked data.--Ratso56 (talk) 00:50, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- @Ratso56: To be clear, I support the edited version, not the original. The way you get the URI is to combine the formatter URL with the value of the property. It does not matter whether the identifier value is a number, or other digits. I'm not sure what you mean by breaking tools. The way this is now shown is consistent with the vast majority of external identifier properties. --99of9 (talk)
- @99of9: Thanks for the indication of support. The question for me is whether Wikidata supports URIs as identifiers per Linked Data principles. Just because the URI happens to have numeric digits in it, doesn't mean the ID is a number, and the edits to date distort the original intent of the property proposal. My interpretation is that datatype=URL or perhaps datatype=external-id is the best way to do that, and I'm concerned that rewriting the ID down to numeric digits moves us away from the linked data approach aspired to, and will actually break tools if URIs are substituted for $1 per the Formatter URL pattern.--Ratso56 (talk) 00:19, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support following Wikidata convention. Wikidata separates the formatter URLs and identifiers in its user interface and property construction, among other reasons because, unfortunately, we've seen way too many cases where - despite best practice recommendations - the former has changed over time. But Wikidata does serve identifiers as URI in the RDF representation of its entities; check for instance the ULAN and VIAF URIs in https://www.wikidata.org/entity/Q4911067.rdf (for William Alexander Sutton (Q4911067)). Spinster 💬 08:07, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support per Spinster and Multichill, just use the numeric ID instead of the full uri. Husky (talk) 08:05, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support as external ID. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 09:55, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support the numeric ID. This will be a very useful property and let us link thousands of artist records, and many more not in Wikidata yet. —Giantflightlessbirds (talk) 09:59, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support. YULdigitalpreservation (talk) 14:39, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support Agree with Spinster and Multichill and support the numeric ID. I've been using this site for a long time and am very keen to see this Wikidata property be approved by the community. Ambrosia10 (talk) 22:21, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support As numerical external ID.
- @Ratso56: Note that the full URL is available in the RDF dumps and from SPARQL, by using the
wdtn:prefix -- see eg this example query https://w.wiki/48X for Library of Congress authority ID (P244) values. So nothing is lost by making it the numerical part that we primarily store, since the full URL required by LOD is readily available. Jheald (talk) 22:16, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
- Support.--Vulphere 12:43, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
Done @Ratso56, Vulphere, Jheald, Ambrosia10, YULdigitalpreservation, Giantflightlessbirds: created as Find NZ Artists ID (P6792). Enjoy! --99of9 (talk) 12:03, 29 May 2019 (UTC)
