Wikidata:Property proposal/forearm length

forearm length[edit]

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Natural science

Not done

Description	length of an animal's forearm
Data type	Quantity
Allowed units	mm, in
Example 1	Giant golden-crowned flying fox (Q775576) → 215 mm
Example 2	little brown bat (Q746127) → 36–40 mm
Example 3	Rousettus aegyptiacus (Q754983) → 81–102 mm
Planned use	Begin adding data for bats with identified forearm lengths on English Wikipedia

Motivation[edit]

Forearm length is one of the most essential characteristics for differentiating bat species, of which there are more than 1,400. Enwebb (talk) 15:17, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion[edit]

WikiProject Taxonomy has more than 50 participants and couldn't be pinged. Please post on the WikiProject's talk page instead. ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 17:05, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds good, though I'd allow mm / cm (and perhaps m for elephants & giraffes!) only, no non-metric stuff - MPF (talk) 17:14, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I take it that this is for mammals only? Lymantria (talk) 17:20, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Lymantria I'm only aware of "forearm length" being a standard measurement for bats. Looks like there's a smattering of usage for humans and other primates, but most results I've seen from search engines are specific to bats. Not to say you couldn't use it for other groups. I just don't think it typically is. Enwebb (talk) 20:14, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Would 'forelimb' be more appropriate than 'forearm'? Friesen5000 (talk) 19:05, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Not sure what the rules are around here, but by English Wikipedia logic, the "common name" of the measurement would be forearm length. 127k results on an exact Google search compared to 15k results for an exact search of "forelimb length". Enwebb (talk) 20:14, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  - Thought it over some more, and no, they are distinct. The forelimb is the entire limb while the forearm is a portion of the forelimb. Enwebb (talk) 13:35, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I think it would be good to specify what's meant with forearm in the description. The Wikidata item for forearm (forearm (Q228537)) is about the part between wrist and elbow which is different then the forelimb which includes the whole arm, hand and shoulder. MeSH's forelimb is also specifically about non-primates. thefreedictionary seems to consider forearm length to be from the tip of the elbow to the tip of the middle finger which means that it does include the hand which our main forearm definition doesn't. ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 21:01, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- It would be useful to be precise about this, and ideally match it to existing data sources. For example, the Pantheria database has lots of relevant data for the following measurement: “8-1_AdultForearmLen_mm: Total length from elbow to wrist of adult (or age unspecified) live, freshly-killed, or museum specimens using captive, wild, provisioned, or unspecified populations; male, female, or sex unspecified individuals; primary, secondary, or extrapolated sources; all measures of central tendency; in all localities.” If the property is consistent with this definition then it would be straightforward to populate Wikidata with this data. --Rdmpage (talk) 06:47, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- For bats, the forearm is discrete and is measured from the elbow to the wrist. No digits included. Enwebb (talk) 13:35, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Tend to Oppose more generic : use
⟨ Giant golden-crowned flying fox (Q775576)    ⟩ has part Search ⟨ Q228537 ⟩
length (P2043) ⟨ 215 mm ⟩
. This works for any part of the body of the organism without needing to create a property for each one. author TomT0m / talk page 09:28, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- I quite like suggestion from @TomT0m: because it also removes ambiguity as to what a "forearm" means, it is defined by forearm (Q228537), which has identifiers from various ontologies (e.g., MESH and UBERON). --Rdmpage (talk) 14:23, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]