Property talk:P780

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Documentation

Descriptionsymptoms that a disease has
Representssymptom (Q169872)
Data typeItem
Domain
According to this template: general diseases - physiological condition (Q7189713)
According to statements in the property:
physiological condition (Q7189713) and fictional medical condition (Q18596079)
When possible, data should only be stored as statements
Allowed valuesall types of symptoms (note: this should be moved to the property statements)
Example
According to statements in the property:
meningitis (Q48143)headache (Q86)
When possible, data should only be stored as statements
Sourcemedical literature (note: this information should be moved to a property statement; use property source website for the property (P1896))
Tracking: usageCategory:Pages using Wikidata property P780 (Q28868243)
Lists
Proposal discussionProposal discussion
Current uses1,120
Search for values
[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]
Value type “clinical sign (Q1441305), symptom (Q169872): This property should use items as value that contain property “instance of (P31)”. On these, the value for instance of (P31) should be an item that uses subclass of (P279) with value clinical sign (Q1441305), symptom (Q169872) (or a subclass thereof). (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P780#Value type Q1441305, Q169872, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
Type “physiological condition (Q7189713), fictional medical condition (Q18596079): element must contain property “instance of (P31)” with classes “physiological condition (Q7189713), fictional medical condition (Q18596079)” or their subclasses (defined using subclass of (P279)). (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P780#type Q7189713, Q18596079, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
Citation needed: the property must have at least one reference (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P780#citation needed, SPARQL (new)


Constraints[edit]

May be instead "One of" it's better to use "Value type"=symptom (Q169872) or some other item? --Infovarius (talk) 11:59, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

Also added constraint on type of the item. --Infovarius (talk) 12:13, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good. I am not sure if people are going to use "instance of" or "subclass of" for symptoms. What would you recommend? --Tobias1984 (talk) 17:07, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
I am not sure too. I prefer "instance" but it is probably against RFD standards. Infovarius (talk) 14:48, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
@Emw:, @TomT0m:: What do you think? --Tobias1984 (talk) 15:01, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
So constraint "subclass of clinical sign (Q1441305)" (which includes symptom) works good, and I removed direct enumeration. --Infovarius (talk) 14:30, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks. Let's work with this and see how it goes. --Tobias1984 (talk) 14:56, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
@Infovarius, Tobias1984, Лорд Алекс: clinical sign (Q1441305) no longer includes symptom. This seems strange. Wikiacc (talk) 18:11, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

symptoms -> cause of[edit]

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Pictogram voting comment.svg Notified participants of WikiProject Medicine

For consistency in how P828 was relabeled from 'medical causes' to 'has cause' to facilitate a broader approach to modeling causes, so this property would make sense to relabel from 'symptoms' to 'cause of'. It would be the inverse property of has cause (P828), and would have the aliases 'has effect', 'has result', 'outcome of', and others.

Like other inverse properties, this property, 'immediate cause of' and 'contributing factor of' would require editors to use common sense. For example, this means not putting 15 million 'cause of' claims in Big Bang (Q323) or physics (Q413). When not used in clearly inappropriate ways this generic property to capture causally downstream information would be quite useful. See also the proposed properties immediate cause of and contributing factor of, and the documentation at Help:Modeling causes. Emw (talk) 14:06, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

I think generalizing the label would still work for medical statements. "Symptoms" should probably be kept as an alias. I also think that "is a cause of" would be easier to understand as a label. Tobias1984 (talk) 19:54, 21 September 2014 (UTC)
Especially for medical statements I would like to keep 'symptom' and use 'cause of/is a cause of' as the alias. For me the 'cause of' property goes together with Disease causative agent and not with the disease itself. Emitraka (talk)

Emitraka, I agree that has symptom would not be a good fit between a disease causative agent and the resulting disease (e.g. "Plasmodium has symptom malaria" is wrong), but why would we need a specific 'cause of' subproperty for the effects of diseases? Doesn't "malaria cause of nausea" make just as much sense as "malaria has symptom nausea"? The fact that something is a symptom could presumably be inferred by it being the object of a cause of statement in a subject that's a type of disease.
I see two options here:
  • Option A: Keep this property labeled 'symptoms', create a new property labled cause of, and mark symptoms as a subproperty of cause of. (See the property proposal under discussion at Wikidata:Property_proposal/Generic#cause_of.)
  • Option B: Change the label of this property from 'symptoms' (i.e. 'has symptom') to 'cause of'. The property would have aliases including 'symptoms', 'has symptom', 'has effect', 'has result', 'outcome of', etc.
The advantage to Option A is that it would provide a specific way to talk about the physiological effects of diseases. (Do we expect to be entering many non-physiological effects of diseases?)
The advantage to Option B is that it would provide a simpler, generic way to talk about causation (for diseases, symptoms, historical events, outcomes, etc.) that's equally expressive as Option B. The same approach could be taken with a potential property has risk factor being expressible as contributing factor of (proposed). Emw (talk) 12:20, 23 September 2014 (UTC)