Wikidata:Property proposal/double major
PROPERTY NAME IN English[edit]
Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic
We imagine a property that works like the following badly created but hopefully understandable image:
The problem is that we are not sure if its possible to have two values connected with a property. If not we are open for other ideas how to solve the problem of double majors.
Motivation[edit]
Universities around the world are granting double majors for their students to study. Studying in a double major program will mean that you have two different academic majors but get only one degree at the end of your study. In order to model this in Wikidata we need a new property so that we can link more than a single qualifier to the grants property of a university.
An example of an unfavorable solution of this problem that currently exists can be found in the item Bachelor of Medicine, Bachelor of Surgery (Q13948235). This item has a "has part" property that links the two different degrees together. There are so many different double degrees, trying to model them as a whole-part structure would be very difficlt.
It would be better to say: person -> academic degree -> Bachelor -> double degree -> (1) Genetics & (2) Ecology
This is problematic because it requires that for every double degree we would have to create a new item and use the "has part" property in the same way it is done here. With the introduction of our proposed double major property we could simply link different degrees together without the need to create new items.
- – The preceding unsigned comment was added by AnonymousAmbiguousAlligators (talk • contribs).
- – The preceding unsigned comment was added by WiseWoman (talk • contribs).
Discussion[edit]
We are working in a Master's course on semantic modelling on the topic of modelling academic degrees in Wikidata [1]. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by WiseWoman (talk • contribs).
Support David (talk) 07:02, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
Comment @AnonymousAmbiguousAlligators, WiseWoman: Please sign your comment. I added both names as one revised the proposal of the other. --- Jura 16:07, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
Question – I don't understand this proposal or the given examples. How is it intended to be used? Is it a qualifier to academic degree (P512) or some other property? If so, should it be used twice? What value should main property have? What about triple degrees, quadruple degrees etc. if these exists, can they be handled too? --Dipsacus fullonum (talk) 16:07, 1 July 2019 (UTC)- Comment @Dipsacus fullonum: First with the new property "double major" we wouldn't touch the topic of double, triple or quadruple degrees. It is only used for showing of which majors a deggree consists of (Examples and links seen above). We would use it probably as a qualifier but from my understanding every property can be used as qualifier, but it is not possible to propose a qualifier on its own. The reason we need a property like that is that a degree like "Bachlor of Science" can be acquired by finishing different study programs, for example by studying biology or pyhsics. What emerges is a long list of academic majors for one degree. But what if you get a bachelor of science by studying two majors at the same time? It would not be correct to just add them below each other it is necessary to show the connection of two majors to each other! AnonymousAmbiguousAlligators 16:32, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @AnonymousAmbiguousAlligators: – I already said that I don't understand the examples. Please explain how you intend for the proposed property to be used. If it isn't as a qualificator, how will you record which majors a degree consists of. A property can only have one value. --Dipsacus fullonum (talk) 17:54, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
- @Dipsacus fullonum: – I see your problem. I added a screenshot below the example box for making clear what we try to achieve. And acutally we want a property which points to up to two values. That properties currently only can have one value is not good. But we would need two values to be able to moodel "double majors" on Wikidata. Apart from the idea that something like that is necessary we don't have a clear understanding what is possible on Wikidata. Maybe you have a better idea how to handle this Problem? --AnonymousAmbiguousAlligators 6:59, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
- It might be easier if you try to add actual statements on Q4115189 preferably with a references. Use Property:P369 for the proposed property. --- Jura 07:40, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
Oppose (A) No, Wikidata does not support two values for a property in a single statement, but (B) Wikidata does support having two values for a property in separate statements. Do that. ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:25, 26 July 2019 (UTC)- Oppose In one country, your proposal will be valid, then in another no (even if there has been a harmonization in recent years, see Bologna Process (Q187073) to convince you). You surely think about this article that is specifically titled on a country, the United States of America (Q30). IMHO, WD being multilingual, your proposal, in this state, is not valid. —Eihel (talk) 05:45, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
- But we have encountered this "double major" problem in many other countries. There are also "joint degree" programs that are offered by two or more universities. We do need some way of modeling this! --WiseWoman (talk) 09:42, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
re-open
Not done Open Proposal since 1 month and a half and it doesn't seem to lead to a Property.
- I think we can close this. I don't think they have provided the requested samples and a new proposal might be formulated more clearly. --- Jura 09:54, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
- Ok, Jura. I thought WiseWoman wanted to continue on this proposal, that's why this re-opening. But if you and I think the same thing… (That said, the closure is accessible to everyone)
Not done —Eihel (talk) 10:17, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
- Ok, Jura. I thought WiseWoman wanted to continue on this proposal, that's why this re-opening. But if you and I think the same thing… (That said, the closure is accessible to everyone)
- Sorry, I only teach this course in the summer terms, so we won't be revisiting the question until April 2020. Please don't delete, we will be discussing this issue at the WikidataCon in Berlin. --WiseWoman (talk) 10:51, 17 October 2019 (UTC)
- @ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2, Jura1, Dipsacus fullonum, ArthurPSmith: Closed - open - re-closed, then a request to keep this proposal for more than 280 days. With all these oppositions, what do you think? I'm lost. —Eihel (talk) 17:31, 17 October 2019 (UTC)
- Everyone I spoke to at WikidataCon agreed that there was no easy or clean way to model this issue ;). I would appreciate leaving the discussion here, so that my next group of students can attack it and see if they can come up with a possible solution. Thanks! --WiseWoman (talk) 21:00, 20 January 2020 (UTC)
- @ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2, Jura1, Dipsacus fullonum, ArthurPSmith: Closed - open - re-closed, then a request to keep this proposal for more than 280 days. With all these oppositions, what do you think? I'm lost. —Eihel (talk) 17:31, 17 October 2019 (UTC)
- Sorry, I only teach this course in the summer terms, so we won't be revisiting the question until April 2020. Please don't delete, we will be discussing this issue at the WikidataCon in Berlin. --WiseWoman (talk) 10:51, 17 October 2019 (UTC)