Topic on User talk:Hannolans

Hi there! I just noticed a lot of musical artists started throwing constraint violations for the copyright collectives representing them, did you mean to make that change? I started to correct it, but figured I'd ask in case there was a plan behind it. To sum it up, I use "copyright representative" to link songwriters/composers to copyright collectives like BMI, ASCAP, SGAE, SACEM, STEMRA, etc. and I need to know if this is not considered correct.

Great! That should be the correct use. I changed some of the constraint settings because of constraint violations of the visual artists. Do you have examples of constraint violations?

I added back Q1047437 under value type constraint and the violations disappeared. I realize that juridical person should suffice, but I find that value type constraints aren't always happy with deep subclass nesting?

Anyways, as long as we have the same understanding of what the property should be used for I'm happy 👍 Feel free to alter the constraint to something better, if I see violations pop up again I'll let you know.

Have an excellent Sunday!

ah, yes, constraints seem to overlook subclasses sometimes. Is there an identifier to link to music collective copyright organisations? For musical works we have {{P|P4894}}, {{P|P4860}} and {{P|P1827}}

for works not in ascap/BMI I have tried to "standardize" using Property:P972 "catalog", as in this example: Lo mejor de tu vida

I've established a few of them:

Q50808010 (SGAE), Q51796663 (SACEM), Q52354815 (SADAIC), Q64029229 (SIAE), etc.

...also Q54959446 (GEMA), Q64686643 (BUMA/STEMRA), Q64362152 (SESAC) and probably a few more that I can't remember at the moment

if in the future we get external identfiers for them, converting shouldn't be too hard.

great! would be interesting when one of them are accessible to connect with an external identifier.

Yeah, I would nominate GEMA as a first test-case, the Germans are super organized (surprise, surprise) with really well documented identifiers and clearly defined IPI roles. BUMA/STEMRA on the other end of the spectrum, have no (visible) identifiers and won't even display ISWC. SACEM and SIAE are somewhere in the middle. SGAE is also pretty good,

SACEM seems one that gives us the possibility to give a direct link, this for example is a link to a composition called 'Holiday': https://repertoire.sacem.fr/detail-oeuvre/gBdJ3CQCp1YPqmYHK5Eye02Z3X_A7qM9CEc7cb8YkPY=/HOLIDAY?query=&filters=titles#searchBtn and also with English labels, for example 'Yesterday died'. Too bad I can't remove 'YESTERDAY DIED' from the url.... https://repertoire.sacem.fr/en/work-detail/uoNgnBEHIvAwlRtfystAmu-F_kXtifvMh4RCgTgFLCQ=/YESTERDAY%20DIED?query=&filters=parties#searchBtn GEMA would be perfect if we are able to create links but they use Ajax.

Ah, YESTERDAY DIED is not required, only a random letter is required: https://repertoire.sacem.fr/en/work-detail/uoNgnBEHIvAwlRtfystAmu-F_kXtifvMh4RCgTgFLCQ=/Z?query=&filters=parties#searchBtn that mean we can use uoNgnBEHIvAwlRtfystAmu-F_kXtifvMh4RCgTgFLCQ as an identifier for a work in SACEM. But better if we can create identifiers for artists.

nice discovery! I tried the same some time ago (removing title) and when it didn't work I concluded that only the combo was a valid id. This opens up some possibilities, very cool.

I think the Argentinean one (Q52354815) can be direct-linked/scraped by playing around with the iframe. And maybe Q56576443 (SACEM, mexico) also? It's been a while since I fiddled with it

the holy grail is direct-linking http://iswcnet.cisac.org/ though, I friggin hate that stupid session-timeout stuff they have going on...

both SIAE and SGAE use captcha, so I guess those are a no-go?

Scraping is always possible. But identifiers without sessions are needed to use it as an external idproperty.

are you on Telegram? It's a bit late in the evening now, but maybe we could continue this conversation over there? Would be cool if we could develop this into something more concrete, I'm always game for improving music on WD and copyright collectives are absolute key to that work.

not very active, but you should find me under my name.

SADAIC is available with identifiers:

by SADAIC-identifier: https://www.sadaic.org.ar/obras.query.php?titulo=&autor=&tipo=abierta&iswc=&nro_obra=418152

by ISWC-code: https://www.sadaic.org.ar/obras.query.php?titulo=&autor=&tipo=abierta&iswc=T0373391811&nro_obra=

SADAIC-code seems to give the copyright partition https://www.sadaic.org.ar/obras.repartos.php?nro_obra=418152

And they have identifiers and links to authors! https://www.sadaic.org.ar/obras.autor.php?codigo=9803

pretty sweet :-) We could maybe make a concerted effort to update WD composition items with publishers also, that's hardly being done by anyone. I've done a few but it's kinda of a pain since 99.99% of the music publishing companies aren't in WD and have to be created.