Property talk:P246
Documentation
identifier for a chemical element
[A-Z][a-z]?|U[nubtqphsoe]{2}”: value must be formatted using this pattern (PCRE syntax). (Help)
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Please notify projects that use this property before big changes (renaming, deletion, merge with another property, etc.) |
Generalization[edit]
How about generalizing this property, including all Unicode symbols, as (for example) astronomic symbols? --Ricordisamoa 16:10, 13 April 2013 (UTC)
- NO. Because element symbols are scientific symbols for element and not the Unicode symbol: for example gold is described with the scientific symbol Au and the Unicode symbol is ☉ which the symbol of the sun too. 178.237.94.235 08:19, 14 April 2013 (UTC)
- This property represents the symbols defined there and it's completly different from Unicode symboles. 178.237.94.235 08:23, 14 April 2013 (UTC)
@Tobias1984: Unicode character (P487) is about pictographs, alchemical and astrological symbols, etc. There is also scientific notation that is neither pictographs nor symbols of chemical elements, such as “e” for electron (Q2225), “γ” for photon (Q3198), symbols for units (Hz = hertz (Q39369)), for quantities, standard abbreviations, mathematical notation, and so on. Though I agree, it would be unwise to far-fetch P246 to cover that stuff. Incnis Mrsi (talk) 09:48, 7 February 2020 (UTC)
format constraint[edit]
i changed it from [A-Z][a-z]? to [A-Z][ub]?[a-z]? for Uue, Ubn, etc. --Akkakk 23:11, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
- Changed it to: Ub? OR Uu? OR Ut? (for untriunium (Q428629) and the like) OR the more normal [A-Z][a-z]. - LaddΩ chat ;) 16:39, 6 April 2014 (UTC)
Subclasses or instances ?[edit]
According to the list of "element type" constraint violations, there seems to be 54 items that are instance of (P31) of chemical element (Q11344), while 76 elements are not (e.g.gold (Q897) and fluorine (Q650), respectively). Questions:
- Are all elements subclass of (P279) chemical element (Q11344) ?
- Elements should or should not bear instance of (P31) chemical element (Q11344) ?
I found no info on these base properties in Wikidata:WikiProject Chemistry/Properties.
Notified participants of WikiProject Chemistry - LaddΩ chat ;) 14:39, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
- Properties for element are there. Then for answer the question above we have to take account of isotope and from there we go back to that discussion.
- In my opinion isotop are instance of element and element are subclass of chemical element.
- germanium-73 (Q2437511) instance of (P31) germanium (Q867)
- germanium (Q867) subclass of (P279) chemical element (Q11344) Snipre (talk) 14:51, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
- For explanation/description of how things should be defined use this section. Snipre (talk) 14:54, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
- Very clear now. Indeed it makes sense that elements are groups of isotopes. Will change and document accordingly. LaddΩ chat ;) 16:35, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
- For explanation/description of how things should be defined use this section. Snipre (talk) 14:54, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
Constraint atomic number[edit]
Every item should also have atomic number (P1086).
Notified participants of WikiProject Chemistry Tamawashi (talk) 22:01, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
- OK,
Done LaddΩ chat ;) 01:44, 19 July 2014 (UTC)
Extend to common symbols for groups and placeholders?[edit]
There are some common pseudo-element symbols (w:en:Skeletal_formula#Pseudoelement_symbols) commonly used as abbreviations, especially in organic chemistry and coordination chemistry, including:
- Me: methyl
- Et: ethyl
- Ph: phenyl
- Ac: acetyl (different from actinium)
- acac: acetylacetonate
- Cp: cyclopentadienyl
- Cp*: pentamethylcyclopentadienyl
- EDTA: ethylenediaminetetraacetate
There are also some symbols commonly used as placeholders, e.g.:
- R: organic substituent
- M: metal
- X: halogen
Should this property be extended to cover these? It would require relaxing some of the property constraints. 2620:0:1000:3510:87E3:A16B:9A15:65AA 23:28, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
datatype change?[edit]
As noticed on Property_talk:P10113#datatype_change?, we forgot to convert this to external-id. It currently has a distinct value constraint with no violations. --- Jura 18:31, 14 December 2021 (UTC)
- One of most important property for chemical elements will be at the end of page? It sounds as not good idea. JAn Dudík (talk) 07:47, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
- Datatype isn't determined by placement on Wikidata pages.
- However, it could easily be ordered as the first of external identifiers. --- Jura 10:51, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
- But this is not an external-id... So why its datatype should be changed? It should remain as a string datatype which is correct. Wostr (talk) 13:19, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
- it's a unique identifier for the item in another system. Why wouldn't it have external-id datatype? It's not a mere random string value. --- Jura 13:21, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
- Which another system? Per Wikidata:External identifiers these are "used in external systems (databases, authority control files, online encyclopedias, etc.)". In that sense chemical element symbol isn't specific to any particular external system, is it? 2001:7D0:81DA:F780:B526:2A53:128C:A661 11:01, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
- In this sense chemical name, and in fact any other name, can be seen as an external-id... Nonsense. And chemical symbols are not unique, only the ones used today (there are some that are not used today for specific elements, but are used for others: Am, At, Cp, Pa...). Wostr (talk) 15:13, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
- Isn't this more of a name than an identifier though? The chemical elements are fundamental, so to me it makes sense that the datatype is a string. CAS numbers and names for more complex chemicals are assigned, so in those cases it makes more sense to call them identifiers. Infrastruktur (talk) 15:34, 22 January 2022 (UTC)