Wikidata talk:List generation input

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Additional scenarios[edit]

A2: new topics[edit]

It might be interesting to add a scenario based on @Llywelyn2000:'s experience. This as he already uses Wikidata extensively for such lists (cywiki seems to be a top user of Wikidata lists).--- Jura 08:53, 29 August 2016 (UTC)

Other than that, (after reading the subpages that are now available), I think it's a good start! --- Jura 09:17, 29 August 2016 (UTC)

Maybe the usecase can be described as follows:
1. I'd like to expand coverage of an underdeveloped topic in Wikipedia
2. I build a query to list items/likely article topics
3. I select properties from Wikidata that are useful.
4. I add a list to Wikipedia
5. (Optional) I limit output to non-existing articles
The main difference to the three usecases mentioned, could be that it's more likely to occur in a smaller Wikipedia that doesn't already have a stub on every subject.
--- Jura 11:40, 30 August 2016 (UTC)
Hello Jura! Thanks for sharing this usecase. Is this the one you referred to above? (Quoting: »…add a scenario based on Llywelyn2000's experience«)
If I read it right, the differences to Scenario A (in addition to the more likely occurrence on small Wikipedias) would be:
  • That a new list is created instead of an old one being extended
  • The specific need to expand topic coverage
Is that correct?
Would the list be mainly generated to create new articles or to have the list itself? I wondered
  • if 4. I add the list to Wikipedia is optional too
  • where the list with …limit output to non-existing articles would be created – I assume it would not be a normal article-namespace list.
I would be happy if you could help me along in understanding this better!
Jan Dittrich (WMDE) (talk) 11:47, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
a. > " Is this the one you referred to above? "
It would really be up to User:Llywelyn2000 to confirm that, but looking at the lists at cy:Arbennig:WhatLinksHere/Nodyn:Wikidata_list I think I shouldn't be off by much.
b. Re: differences
Yes. Usecase (#B2:_dynamic_list) below would be a replacement with a dynamic list. An additional element might be that Wikidata:List generation input/Scenario A completing focuses on the lists itself instead of potential new articles. This usecase should probably include a step with data completion (at Wikidata), but it's really secondary.
c. > "Would the list be mainly generated to create new articles or to have the list itself?"
I think if the list is placed in article namespace, it would be both. Depending on the local community, Listeria lists are currently placed in article namespace (or not). Obviously, if the list is limited to non-existing topics, it's placed outside article namespace.
-- Jura 12:08, 1 September 2016 (UTC)

B2: dynamic list[edit]

For an index list of an infinite topic, the manually edited list should be replaced by a dynamic one.

Steps would be the same as (A), but (5) might either be all items or only existing items.

This scenario is suitable for smaller Wikipedias and larger ones.
--- Jura 11:40, 30 August 2016 (UTC)

+1 for the 'new topics' scenario that Jura1 outlined. Wikidata has broader notability criteria than Wikipedia and it can be very useful in suggesting subjects for new Wikipedia articles (redlink lists), for instance part of Wikiprojects.
One real example is this list of redlinks for women artists that have no article on Dutch Wikipedia yet. It is a very useful to do list for the gender gap project on nlwiki. The list generated by Listeria is useful, but I have some suggestions for improvement:
  • In dynamically / automatically generated lists like these, I'd love to have flexibility in how the list is designed and what is put in each cell. I'd like to be able to combine image, label and description in 1 cell, for instance, to make the list look less 'database-y' and more readable and pleasant to look at.
  • Instead of redlinks I'd like to have the option to have something like Agnes van den Bossche (create this article)
  • I also want to be able work with manually selected series of Q numbers, not just with queries. Like in this case. Not sure if it's handy to list all the items in the source or to work with something external like a PagePile.
  • I notice that Wikipedians don't like to see Q numbers in redlinks. I find that understandable. Let's avoid them. See discussion on Magnus' talk page.
  • I'd like it if IDs of identifier properties in these lists were clickable, i.e. 11161 rather than 11161
  • Some of the items in the list have articles on other Wikipedias. I want to be able to create a column with links to these articles. Ideally, these links could even contain a translation link so that people can start translating articles from other languages immediately. Preferably all available articles in all languages in 1 column, so not like in Dynamic Lists where you have to pre-decide which languages you want to see.
Spinster 💬 08:49, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
Hello Spinster, Hello Jura, we included this (among other ones) in our list of scenarios.
Carefully reading about the use of lists to find new/missing topics again, we wondered: Is there usually a step of creating items on Wikidata to supplement the generated list? Or is it usually the case that Wikidata has the needed items? If this is the case, the scenario may have a possible step like "review the generated list (e.g. of female artists) . If you see that some items are missing (a female artist you know), add them to wikidata" (or in another way, depending on your workflow). --Jan Dittrich (WMDE) (talk) 15:52, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
It depends on what source we choose to use on Wikidata. In the example of RKDartists above, I might indeed go to Mix'n'Match and see if I can find more female artists in the RKDartists dataset, look how notable they are, and then create them on Wikidata (but that's not necessary). I'm also doing a personal project where I'm inventorizing designer chairs, adding many to Wikidata first, and then at some point I'll look which ones deserve articles on Wikipedia. Sometimes we also create lists of redlinks based on coverage on other Wikipedias (example) and there you wouldn't go and create new Wikidata items. But in general Wikidata is a pretty solid starting point and not much new creation of items is needed. We already find plenty of work with what is already on Wikidata but not on Wikipedia yet! Spinster 💬 16:57, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
Another use-case of dynamic lists is that even when the list entries are manually added, the values of a cell for an entry row can be automatically updated when they are updated in Wikidata; in other words, the cell contents are dynamic. One example of this is automatically listing the roads a bridge passes over. Another example is where an entry in a list does not yet have a Wikipedia article to link to, but may have one added in the future, the Template:Wikidata template can be used with the "linked" parameter (however, if this is being used for the "name" field of the entry, the question then becomes, how to ensure that editors of the list can realize what the entry refers to, if only its Wikidata Q-number, and not the name, shows up in the editor?). --Hhm8 (talk) 04:23, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

C2: model lists in Wikidata to expand Wikidata[edit]

Another usecase:

  • 1. I have 251 lists at Wikipedia
  • 2. I like to know which properties are missing to build a Wikidata list with the same columns
  • 3. I like to complete automatically Wikidata with the missing elements/items to ensure such lists cover the same rows
  • 4. I like to build a query to model these 251 lists at Wikidata

Hope it's clear.
--- Jura 10:26, 5 September 2016 (UTC)


D2: add a map of windmills in Anglesey to Wikipedia[edit]

Another usecase from a discussion with Llywelyn2000:

  • 1. I'd like to replace the static map at cy:Rhestr_o_felinau_gwynt_yn_Ynys_Môn
  • 2. I build a query to retrieve the list of windmills from Wikidata
  • 3. I complete the items at Wikidata
  • 4. I add the map to Wikipedia

In the meantime, this might be possible with the graph extension.
--- Jura 17:40, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Awards[edit]

Hoi, the lists that I have created regularly are lists of award winners for an award. I prefer to have them sorted date descending. When a new award winners is announced and added to Wikidata it will automatically update. Thanks, GerardM (talk) 18:13, 29 August 2016 (UTC)


Completeness Marks[edit]

Hello,

it would be interesting if Wikidata-generated lists can be improved with completeness marks, just like existing Wikipedia lists: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-five_Year_Award The list uses the template Complete List: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Complete_list

Cheers, Fadirra (talk) 08:44, 30 August 2016 (UTC)

The problem is that updating a list is based on changing statements on items. So a list can be updated without ever touching the item for a list. So it can be complete without anyone noticing this. Updating lists in Wikipedia is also based on whatever happens on Wikidata.
In my opinion we could have queries and, they do exist showing all the awards that have no 2015 awardee. Thanks, GerardM (talk) 09:36, 30 August 2016 (UTC)
You could add a dated statement on the item for the award.
--- Jura 11:41, 30 August 2016 (UTC)
  • For things with a regular frequency, it could be queried .. actually we already have some queries for awards.
    --- Jura 11:31, 1 September 2016 (UTC)

API/Lua[edit]

Is in scope to create API and/or Lua functions for lists generation? --ValterVB (talk) 16:55, 31 August 2016 (UTC)

Hello ValterVB, thanks for your question! The input here should help us in answering which features and user interfaces we need to provide in order to choose the best underlying technology. API or Lua seem to be decent ways (but I'm not a programmer, at least not beyond some JavaScript, so others might know more). --Jan Dittrich (WMDE) (talk) 11:27, 1 September 2016 (UTC)

Using Wikidata to create a list article from scratch[edit]

Hi all

Apologies if this is covered within one of the other examples and I have missed it, I am importing some of UNESCO's data into Wikidata and would like to create English Wikipedia articles including all the links to other articles already added when the list is generated. This list would appear in the article as a table with several columns and then I would just add an introductory paragraph and it would be ready to publish. One example of this would be 'List of Journalists killed during their work' and include their name, nationality, where and when they were killed and a link to the official UN condemnation.

Thanks

--John Cummings (talk) 14:54, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

That should already be possible with help of SPARQL. See w:en:Template:Wikidata list. --Edgars2007 (talk) 16:32, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Feedback from Wikipedia?[edit]

As the three scenarios are meant for Wikipedia users, I wonder if you don't want to add this to Wikipedia sites instead.
--- Jura 08:26, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

Translating a list from one language into another[edit]

Frequently the English Wikipedia has a list that covers a topic well and there's interest of people to translate the list into another language. ChristianKl (talk) 17:53, 30 September 2016 (UTC)