Wikidata:Property proposal/Mentioned at

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Mentioned at[edit]

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Creative work

   Not done
DescriptionProperty for fictional works, to registrate things, persons, works or whatever that appears in a work, but it's not depicted or described.
Data typeItem
Example 1The novel "Tirant lo blanc" is mentioned at "The Quixote" Don Quixote (Q480)Tirant lo Blanc (Q559667)
Example 2La song "Something" is mentioned by a character in a book
Example 3The novel "Cánovas" by Galdós mentions the opera "Robert le diable". Cánovas (Q5795905)Robert le diable (Q1071310)
Planned useWe are working descibring elements tha appears in fictional works
See alsoThis seems to be a subproperty of P180 Depicted. In that case the element is well described, but in the property proposed it's only mentioned. It's also different to P2860 "cites work".

Motivación[edit]

When describing works of fiction, there is often the needing of include things mentinoned but not described. If, for example, a monument is described, the P180 property would be fine, but it that monument is only mentioned ii could be useful to register that case. This case is different from the property "Reference" to describe cites between creative works.

Discussion[edit]

  • BA candidate.svg Weak oppose Interesting proposal, but with respect to your examples I think you can just use cites work (P2860) here. It was created with scholarly cases in mind, but I don't see any reason to not use it for non-scholarly creative works, too. http://purl.org/dc/terms/references and https://schema.org/citation are set as equivalent properties, which are defined as "A related resource that is referenced, cited, or otherwise pointed to by the described resource." and "A citation or reference to another creative work, such as another publication, web page, scholarly article, etc." I used this property to indicate referenced works in Nabokov's Lolita: Q127149#P2860.
But cites work (P2860) is a relation between works, and I'm thinking in "things": Martin Luther King is mentioned by a caharacter in the novel "The Nix", or they are watching a TV programme called "Saturday night live". It's not depicted or described, but it could be usefeul for enriching description of cultural and social context of creative works. --Tsaorin (talk) 17:55, 11 November 2019 (UTC)

In other cases I think only relevant mentions should be recorded in Wikidata (there were already several proposals of a mentions-property in Wikidata, all of them rejected e.g. because of it being too vague or inviting for an excessive use - e.g. a novel mentioning thousands of things or a person mentioned by thousands of works). Are there relevant cases not covered by already existing properties (e.g. characters (P674), depicts (P180), main subject (P921), present in work (P1441), narrative location (P840), set in period (P2408), literary motif (P6962))? Maybe one could think about creating a more striking property for those cases. - Valentina.Anitnelav (talk) 13:16, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

I wonder if depicts (P180) and other property as "P-Described at" could be subclasses of a more generic property as "P-Featured in", so you can use this generic property if the thing is not well-described o depicted. --Tsaorin (talk) 17:55, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
But present in work (P1441) is restricted to Characters, and there are cases in where, for example, a characters is speaking about Martin Luther King, but MLK isn't a character in that work. --Tsaorin (talk) 17:55, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
The same that above, the domain of this relation is characters, and there are more things that appears in a fictional work. --Tsaorin (talk) 17:55, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
  •  Not done per discussion above --DannyS712 (talk) 20:08, 10 November 2019 (UTC)