Talk:Q512262

Fiction can be a film genre

@MovieFex: Please understand that fiction is a genre for both literature and films. If a film is a detective film, it is of course also a detective fiction. So it is correct to add detective fiction (Q186424) as genre to this item. --Neo-Jay (talk) 23:43, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: In this case detective fiction (Q186424) is a property for literatur and there is no property for detective film available. There is fiction film (Q12912091) and crime film (Q959790) you can use, both are film genres. The difference is similar to drama (Q25372) and drama film (Q130232). -- MovieFex (talk) 23:57, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: "Detective fiction" (Q186424) can be a property for both literature and films because fiction is a genre for both literature and films (please look up the word "fiction" in a dictionary or check Wikipedia relevant articles). It's acceptable to add "detective fiction" as a property to this item since there is no item for "detective film". --Neo-Jay (talk) 00:04, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: Check Detective fiction in the english Wiki and then watch the categories in this article. --MovieFex (talk) 00:10, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: English article en:Detective fiction does not say that detective fiction only refers to literature. And being included in "Category:Literary genres" does not mean that it cannot be included in "Category:Film genres". For your information, "fiction can be expressed in a variety of formats, including writings, live performances, films, television programs, animations, video games, and role-playing games..." (see Wikipedia:en:Fiction). --Neo-Jay (talk) 00:17, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: Wikipedia:en:Fiction is a preamble for a genre wich can be splittet in subclasses like literature and film. But here is no property for detective film. If there is a property missing you can ask for it, but don't use a wrong one. --MovieFex (talk) 00:27, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: It is not a wrong one. As I said, detective film is a subclass of detective fiction. So if a film's genre is detective film, then it of course is also detective fiction. Please don't think that detective fiction is a genre only for literature. It is apparently also a genre for films. --Neo-Jay (talk)

@Neo-Jay: Here in WD is NO property for detective film, for literature only. Ask for it or create one, but this property you want to use is wrong as a property for film! --MovieFex (talk) 00:37, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: How can you say that "detective fiction" (Q186424) is for literature only? As I pointed it out very clearly, fiction is a genre for both literature and films. So "detective fiction" (Q186424) can be used as a property for both literature and films. Again, please understand that fiction is not only for literature. --Neo-Jay (talk) 00:43, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: I gave an example above, see drama (Q25372) and drama film (Q130232) (or fantasy (Q132311) and fantasy film (Q157394)). Drama is not for literature or film only too, but there are both available here and detective film is not. --MovieFex (talk) 00:52, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: Your example is irrelevant here. Because there are already "drama film" and "fantasy film" at Wikidata, there is no need to use "drama" and "fantasy" as genre for films. But there is no "detective film" at Wikidata now, so it is acceptable to use "detective fiction" as genre for films. It is not wrong. --Neo-Jay (talk) 00:59, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: If the property "detective film" is missing I told you what you can do. Using "detective fiction" for film is not acceptable. --MovieFex (talk) 01:04, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: What you told me is wrong. I do not accept your "guidance". Again, it is acceptable to use "detective fiction" when there is no "detective film" yet. "Fiction" of course can be a film genre. --Neo-Jay (talk) 01:12, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: I agree that "Fiction" can be a film genre, but yet there is no property for this in WD. You are working for d:Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P136 --MovieFex (talk) 01:26, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

@MovieFex: When there is no "detective film" at Wikidata, "detective fiction" can be used as "genre" for films at Wikidata. Adding "detective fiction" (Q186424) is not a constraint violation. Q186424 is an instance of "genre" (Q483394). There is no requirement that a film's genre must be an instance of "film genre" (Q201658). It's acceptable that a film's genre is an instance of "genre" (Q483394) (see "value type constraint" of P136, Property "genre"). --Neo-Jay (talk) 01:42, 11 February 2018 (UTC)