Property talk:P7378

Documentation

• Start a query
• Current uses
• Statistics by class
• List of values
• List of qualifiers
• Count

item disputed by
concept described by the item is criticized by other item(s)

Data type	Item
Example	capitalism (Q6206) → anti-capitalism (Q389647) cognitivism (Q23382) → embodied cognition (Q1335050) oralism (Q1411862) → Edward Miner Gallaudet (Q1293026)
See also	statement disputed by (P1310)
Lists	Items with the most statements of this property Count of items by number of statements (chart) Items with the most statements Items with the fewest statements Count of items by number of sitelinks (chart) Items with the most sitelinks Items with the most sitelinks, but no link to one Wikipedia (sample: Welsh Wikipedia, cywiki) Items with the fewest sitelinks Most linked wikis Items with the most identifier properties By value of property Most statements Fewest statements Most sitelinks Most linked wikis Total of sitelinks on items Most identifiers Fewest identifiers Items with no other statements Most recently created items Items with novalue claims Items with unknown value claims Usage history (total) Usage history (main statement) Database reports/Constraint violations/P7378 Map Random list
Proposal discussion	Proposal discussion
Current uses	Total 44 Main statement 40 90.9% of uses Qualifier 4 9.1% of uses
Search for values

[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]

Allowed entity types are Wikibase item (Q29934200): the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P7378#Entity types

Scope is as main value (Q54828448): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P7378#Scope, SPARQL

How can an item be disputed?

Having read the property proposal, and being interested in representing political data, I'm not sure how this new property is supposed to be used. Marx wrote a lot about capitalism and described it as an inevitable part of society's evolution. So it's not that Marx or Marxists dispute the existence of capitalism: they dispute some further claim about it. They dispute that it is the fairest system, or the morally best system, or that it's an inevitable end point of progress. Another example given was free software disputing proprietary software. Now almost anyone working in free software must know that proprietary software exists, so it's not that they dispute the concept of proprietary software. It's not as if free software developers must oppose the existence of proprietary software: some might, but it's possible to just want there to be free alternatives, or think that proprietary software is best for some applications and free software for others. So the idea that an item is disputed isn't clear to me logically, in the way that it's clear to say that a statement is disputed. @Simulo:, as proposer, can you clarify how you want this property to be read? MartinPoulter (talk) 14:40, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

@MartinPoulter: – I am sorry that I get to this after quite some delay. Your examples refer to disputing the existence of the item the property is used on. As I tried to outline in the proposal, the property is not meant to signify the denial of existence (Don't know if this would make sense for social concepts like the ones suggested in the property description and proposal). The property signifies that the value (a person or social movement, usually) disputes the item as problematic as in the everyday use of "I criticize…" or "I think, …is problematic". In case you think that this use is not clear, I would have no problem if the property would be given a more precise title (E.g. I considered/suggested "argues against" and "criticizes", too). --Simulo (talk) 21:06, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

My sense of the verb "to dispute" is similar to MartinPoulter's, and it is also cognant with the use of statement disputed by (P1310), and to varying degrees by its use in Jesus (Q302)item disputed by (P7378)atheism (Q7066). After a quick check with dictionaries it seems to be commonly used with meanings other than "to deny the existence of", but I also get the impression that it evokes (a) verbal utterances more than written, (b) face-to-face encounters, and (c) some level of aggression. On another level, "to dispute" seems too broad, theoretically calling for endless lists of critics and pamphlets arguing against capitalism.

There should definitely be a way to link capitalism (Q6206) with Marxism (Q7264), but the term isn't ideal. What's needed is something with the sense of "this person's, movement's, book's, or HBO documentation's raison d'être was to tear down the idea of <x>" (but shorter). Even then, the distinction between "disputes that a person named Jesus of Nazareth ever existed", "[..] was the son of God", or "[..] was broadly a force of good" (in the sense that marxism criticises capitalism) seems difficult to model on the statement level, whereas qualifiers as in Jesus (Q302)instance of (P31)deity (Q178885)statement disputed by (P1310)atheism (Q7066) work well. Matthias Winkelmann (talk) 11:46, 19 July 2020 (UTC)